FanIQ News: Columbus Blue Jackets Need A Financial Fix

11/5/09

1	Something tells me that deficit is going to start becoming a profit either this year or next. The arena was sold out when the Pens were there last week, and by making the playoffs last year and starting off well so far this year, they're getting bigger crowds at their games and really getting a lot of support.

11/5/09

mk_donley

0	I hate to see the BlueJackets leave Columbus. Dadburn! I feel terrible for the fans! I hope the city and others find the solution to keep the team in Ohio.

11/5/09

redsox1002003

1	the NHL never should have moved south. phoenix and nashville are messes, atlanta and both florida clubs are struggling, dallas is probably the only south team doing decently. if columbus didnt make the playoffs last year, they would be in a s*** heap as well, but they have some fans now, so the jackets will be fine.

11/5/09

marcus_nyce

1

redsox1002003 wrote:

the NHL never should have moved south. phoenix and nashville are messes, atlanta and both florida clubs are struggling, dallas is probably the only south team doing decently. if columbus didnt make the playoffs last year, they would be in a s*** heap as well, but they have some fans now, so the jackets will be fine.

Actually Tom Hicks has got some problems in the lone star state too. I totally agree with your point tho. Ever since Wayne went to LA, it has been the leagues priority to make low priority locations work. this is going to get uglier.

11/5/09

redsox1002003

0	marcus_nyce wrote: Actually Tom Hicks has got some problems in the lone star state too. I totally agree with your point tho. Ever since Wayne went to LA, it has been the leagues priority to make low priority locations work. this is going to get uglier. id respect you but i ran out so you get this for now (ill respect you tomorrow, promise)

11/5/09

BengalsFan1288

0	The downtown of Columbus is just now starting to be developed for a night life. The new casino approved on Tuesday will be within two blocks of Nationwide Arena. The new baseball park opened across the street this season. The team does deserve to get a cut of parking revenues and a reduced cost of running the arena. Columbus is a proud city and will not allow the Jackets to leave.

11/6/09

marcus_nyce

0	redsox1002003 wrote: id respect you but i ran out so you get this for now (ill respect you tomorrow, promise) It's all good, that ain't the point. the point was that you made a good point. that's my point. LMAO, there's a lot of points there.

11/6/09

ML31

0

The team has pretty much sucked its entire existence. They are on the cusp of perhaps getting better. When the team does better, the financial fortunes will change. And the new economic structure of the NHL helps.

Don't be so fast to poo poo the teams currently not doing well. In most cases, it is not so much that hockey won't work there but rather because the team stinks. Even in what people think is a great hockey market of Chicago, no one went to the Hawk games when they sucked it up. Why should Atlanta, Columbus or Arizona be any different?

11/6/09

redsox1002003

0

(Edited by redsox1002003)

true, but atlanta, columbus, arizona, nashville, anaheim, san jose, etc. teams shouldnt have existed to begin with. im a ducks fan, but honestly they shouldnt have been created. keep the sport where the sport is actually played. my city has over 300,000 people and ONE club hockey team. put the minors out here, and leave the majors where it matters the most. just my two cents.

11/6/09

ML31

0

redsox1002003 wrote:

true, but atlanta, columbus, arizona, nashville, anaheim, san jose, etc. teams shouldnt have existed to begin with. im a ducks fan, but honestly they shouldnt have been created. keep the sport where the sport is actually played. my city has over 300,000 people and ONE club hockey team. put the minors out here, and leave the majors where it matters the most. just my two cents.

Your welcome to your opinion even if it is wrong!

No reason the NHL should not expand to become a more nationwide thing rather than a regional thing.

I'm not sure what is going on down in LA-LA land. But up here in the Bay Area, the Sharks presence has made hockey more common. The Sharks Ice rink opened with three sheets now has 6. And it is still hard to get ice time. They opened up rinks in Fremont and last year in Oakland. A couple of years ago the first CIF sanctioned high school hockey game was played in the South Bay. There are youth leagues abound. SJSU, Stanford and UCB have had club teams for over 15 years. None of this would have happened were it not for the Sharks.

11/6/09

redsox1002003

0

redsox1002003 wrote:

true, but atlanta, columbus, arizona, nashville, anaheim, san jose, etc. teams shouldnt have existed to begin with. im a ducks fan, but honestly they shouldnt have been created. keep the sport where the sport is actually played. my city has over 300,000 people and ONE club hockey team. put the minors out here, and leave the majors where it matters the most. just my two cents.

exactly, none of it would have happened without the sharks, which means there was nothing before. although i feel california is the exception to the rule, because it is so big, and diverse. but for a team like phoenix who prettymuch failed since day one, there was no need to move them out of winnipeg, they would have built right back up.

11/6/09

redsox1002003

0

ML31 wrote:

Your welcome to your opinion even if it is wrong!

No reason the NHL should not expand to become a more nationwide thing rather than a regional thing.

I'm not sure what is going on down in LA-LA land. But up here in the Bay Area, the Sharks presence has made hockey more common. The Sharks Ice rink opened with three sheets now has 6. And it is still hard to get ice time. They opened up rinks in Fremont and last year in Oakland. A couple of years ago the first CIF sanctioned high school hockey game was played in the South Bay. There are youth leagues abound. SJSU, Stanford and UCB have had club teams for over 15 years. None of this would have happened were it not for the Sharks.

and thats why i said put minor league teams out there, so if they can prove popularity, move the team up to the big leagues. in fact a euro soccer system wouldnt be a bad idea for hockey (and baseball), but thats a different rant for a different time.

11/6/09

ML31

0

redsox1002003 wrote:

exactly, none of it would have happened without the sharks, which means there was nothing before. although i feel california is the exception to the rule, because it is so big, and diverse. but for a team like phoenix who prettymuch failed since day one, there was no need to move them out of winnipeg, they would have built right back up.

Personally, I don't like teams moving. But the fact is, the Jets just weren't going to make it in Winnipeg. The economy was not favorable for them. The arena was old and needed to be upgraded if they were to stay. But the town couldn't afford to put much into it. And even then, if they had the luxury boxes needed for today's game, Winnipeg just doesn't have the corporate sponsors needed to fill them. And if a team were going to move or be created today, Winnipeg just will not even be considered for the above reasons. The fact is, they are better off in Arizona.

But remember... When have the Coyotes been good? Pretty much never. They have made the playoffs a couple of times, but teams don't need to be good for that. They just need to be mediocre. Judge the market when the team is good. Not when it is bad. If you did that for all teams, pretty much only 4 or 5 markets would be suitable for teams.

11/6/09

redsox1002003

0

(Edited by redsox1002003)

i know winnipeg was having problems, but i dont see arizona as the answer. just remember they only had the suns and the other three teams joined within 20 years ago (cards, coyotes, dbacks), so just recently had arizona even been considered pro land. the jets owners took a hell of a chance going out there, but desert and ice hockey just dont mix, and its been proven not only with the coyotes, but with minor league teams as well (phoenix roadrunners ahl,)

11/6/09

ML31

0

redsox1002003 wrote:

i know winnipeg was having problems, but i dont see arizona as the answer. just remember they only had the suns and the other three teams joined within 20 years ago (cards, coyotes, dbacks), so just recently had arizona even been considered pro land. the jets owners took a hell of a chance going out there, but desert and ice hockey just dont mix, and its been proven not only with the coyotes, but with minor league teams as well (phoenix roadrunners ahl,)

The Roadrunners were actually doing OK when the "I" existed. They were forced out of town when the Coyotes arrived. A normal thing. They tried to make it work there in the old arena while the 'Yotes were there. But come on... That was not going to fly from day one.

I don't think anything has been proved about hockey in the desert except that in the days before the National League showed up, minor league hockey was a moderate success.

11/6/09

redsox1002003

0

i meant the most recent version (they moved to toronto). but good point on the old runners. im just saying the jets owners saw a booming region, and success in la, and took a hell of a chance to go out there, and failed. it was a bad idea and i dont think pro hockey belongs in the south except california, and texas, due to pop. size and pop. diversity, and carolina because they proved themselves worthy.

11/6/09

ML31

0

redsox1002003 wrote:

i meant the most recent version (they moved to toronto). but good point on the old runners. im just saying the jets owners saw a booming region, and success in la, and took a hell of a chance to go out there, and failed. it was a bad idea and i dont think pro hockey belongs in the south except california, and texas, due to pop. size and pop. diversity, and carolina because they proved themselves worthy.

Well, actually I think the Whale moving to Carolina was far more unforgivable than the Jets move. That story was just plain evil on the part of the teams owner.

Not sure why you think Carolina is more deserving than Tampa. They both have won Cups. And both have had attendance issues when the team stunk. Both are quite similar.

I promise you, get the Coyotes in the Stanly Cup Finals and you will see the fans come out for them. Give them a REAL contender for a good three or 4 year span and you will see the fans and sponsors come out of the woodwork.

11/6/09

redsox1002003

0

i agree, the whalers never should have moved, but i retract my carolina statement. my bad on that one. in their cup year, they were still 21st in the league. tampa has been top 15 since 2004, except last year. the yotes wont live to see a cup finals, and even this year, they havent averaged 10,000 fans yet, and their over .500! their highest rank this decade is 19th. and is the lowest for the decade.

11/6/09

ML31

0

redsox1002003 wrote:

i agree, the whalers never should have moved, but i retract my carolina statement. my bad on that one. in their cup year, they were still 21st in the league. tampa has been top 15 since 2004, except last year. the yotes wont live to see a cup finals, and even this year, they havent averaged 10,000 fans yet, and their over .500! their highest rank this decade is 19th. and is the lowest for the decade.

I don't know about the Coyotes never seeing a Finals. People thought the Red Sox would never win a World Series either. The team is playing OK right now, but one month of not sucking is hardly a good measuring stick. Like I said, make your assessment when the team turns into contenders.

In terms of attendance, I think the Whale was better off in Hartford. I have no idea how the Canes are doing economically overall. Maybe they have good sponsors or something they never would have had in Hartford. But there are no rumors of them moving. So one has to think they are economically doing at least OK.

For the record... I'll say it again. I HATE the idea of teams moving. That said, there is currently one team who I think can make a case for leaving town. The Panthers. The S Florida market is not a good sports market. Unless you play your events on a gridiron, the area just isn't interested. And besides, I don't think the NHL needs S. Florida to help with their national presence. And I think another western outpost would help. Perhaps Portland, OR.

11/6/09

redsox1002003

0

yeah, but the red sox have no attendence problems, the yotes cant average 10000 right now. i dont think a team should move either, unless they absolutely have zero support. example can be the expos who played half their home games in san juan and averaged 5 fans a game even though they were pretty average, they needed to get out of canada. you mentioned the jets before too. teams like the sonics and browns and whalers were basically hijacked out of their city. the northwest is a location the NHL needs to go. minor league and junior league hockey is HUGE out there, and a pro team would do great.

11/6/09

ML31

1

redsox1002003 wrote:

yeah, but the red sox have no attendence problems, the yotes cant average 10000 right now. i dont think a team should move either, unless they absolutely have zero support. example can be the expos who played half their home games in san juan and averaged 5 fans a game even though they were pretty average, they needed to get out of canada. you mentioned the jets before too. teams like the sonics and browns and whalers were basically hijacked out of their city. the northwest is a location the NHL needs to go. minor league and junior league hockey is HUGE out there, and a pro team would do great.

Attendance has nothing to do with assembling a good team. So the analogy still works.

The Expos are not a good point. They were hijacked. MLB doomed the team to failure when they took over ownership. They never should have allowed the owner to buy another team unless he had a taker for the team he was dumping. There are many cases where teams do lousy at the gate when they suck and draw well at other times. The Expos did draw well for 20 years. It wasn't until fans realized the economic system in place doomed the team to perennially being in the cellar with only the occasional exit. That happens in nearly every MLB market. The Indians couldn't draw anyone when they sucked. Same with the A's and Braves and Tigers. This list goes on.

It was MLB's decision to play Expos home games in Puerto Rico. Further cementing their failure. MLB WANTED the Expos to fail and did everything in their power to make it happen. It was almost like they realized opting for Florida in the '93 expansion was a mistake and tried to make it up by finding a way to get a team in DC. The choice they should have made instead of S Florida.

What the Expos needed was solid ownership who was willing to make a commitment to make it work in Montreal. Sadly, the MLB economic system made that difficult. But not impossible. Hence, there weren't many people willing to buy the Expos. Hell, it took Disney years and years to unload the Angels. And that team is more attractive to own than the Expos.

11/6/09

redsox1002003

0	im tired, so you win this bout, but basically its all about the money. the south is not a sexy location for pro hockey. those teams are making minor league bucks for major league levels. put the minors out there and leave the big boys to where people care.

11/6/09

Jays_Leafs_Ffan

0	my suggestion would be.Your team is only as good as the fans who support the team. Why not make it columbus's team. Give the fans a chance to invest in the team.The fans in hockey give so much why not give something back.Give them incentive to want to go to the games.For example the first 5,000 people through the gates get entered into a draw for $500 dollars.Money talks B.S walks

11/6/09

ML31

0

redsox1002003 wrote:

im tired, so you win this bout, but basically its all about the money. the south is not a sexy location for pro hockey. those teams are making minor league bucks for major league levels. put the minors out there and leave the big boys to where people care.

If the minors do well in those "non sexy" markets, then there is no reason why the Majors wouldn't. There are quite a few people who care in those areas. It's a stereotype. Like thinking football won't do well outside of Texas or basketball won't do well outside of Indiana or baseball can't do well in places where bad weather intrudes on the baseball season.

11/6/09

ML31

0

Jays_Leafs_Ffan wrote:

my suggestion would be.Your team is only as good as the fans who support the team. Why not make it columbus's team. Give the fans a chance to invest in the team.The fans in hockey give so much why not give something back.Give them incentive to want to go to the games.For example the first 5,000 people through the gates get entered into a draw for $500 dollars.Money talks B.S walks

It sounds kind of crazy but the Green Bay Packers are publicly owned... So maybe....

11/6/09

redsox1002003

0

ML31 wrote:

If the minors do well in those "non sexy" markets, then there is no reason why the Majors wouldn't. There are quite a few people who care in those areas. It's a stereotype. Like thinking football won't do well outside of Texas or basketball won't do well outside of Indiana or baseball can't do well in places where bad weather intrudes on the baseball season.

i see what you are saying, but the southern teams are putting up attendence and revenue numbers that would be great for a minor league level, but isnt cutting it professionally. they can still care for those teams, but for minor league.

11/6/09

redsox1002003

0

Jays_Leafs_Ffan wrote:

my suggestion would be.Your team is only as good as the fans who support the team. Why not make it columbus's team. Give the fans a chance to invest in the team.The fans in hockey give so much why not give something back.Give them incentive to want to go to the games.For example the first 5,000 people through the gates get entered into a draw for $500 dollars.Money talks B.S walks

that is a good idea. instead of these money grubbing idiots owning the team, let the ones who care own it.

11/6/09

ML31

0

redsox1002003 wrote:

i see what you are saying, but the southern teams are putting up attendence and revenue numbers that would be great for a minor league level, but isnt cutting it professionally. they can still care for those teams, but for minor league.

The problem is the only figure that anyone not on the inside can see are attendance figures. And those can be explained by the quality of the team people are watching. Good team: Good attendance. Bad team: Bad attendance. That's not exactly rocket science. Revenue figures are pure guesswork.

Also, consider this... Minor League hockey has tried and failed a few times in the Bay Area. Yet the Sharks do great. The Sharks even drew well when they sucked. There is no tried and true formula.

Thus far, there is no good reason for the NHL to abandon the Arizona market. None. Unfortunately, there WAS good reason for the Jets to abandon Winnipeg.