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2/13/08
Brian McNamee vs Roger Clemens Before Congress Live-Blog
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This might be the worst idea of all-time, but yes I'll be live blogging these congressional hearing. Please stop by and keep me company.

Who's knows what will happen today -- I've set the bar very, very low -- but I think Dan Wetzel sums it up best: Roger Clemens is either innocent or stupid. The evidence, or perceived evidence, that is mounting certainly points to Clemens being a colossal idiot.

It's pretty obvious what we'll hear -- two different stories, but it's more important I believe what we see. Lying in front of Congress, committing perjury can't be done without some squeamishness.

So I'll be giving you my take on what's happening. I'm not a Roger Cossack, but I did sleep in my parents basement last night.

Live-Blogging commences after the jump ...
 

Pre-Game Roger Clemens has issued a statement prior to the hearing, they both will apparently, but Bob Ley tells us that Rocket details his goodwill, and having gone to visit the troops in Iraq and Afghanistan. That's great. Now, did you take HGH or not?

Question for you all (two of you) -- Isn't it bothersome that Clemens spend the whole week schmoozing with Congress privately? Since I trust our elected officials as much as Tracy McGrady's back, I don't feel good about this.

I'm regretting the fact I didn't look up any prop bets for this "event." You know they are out there ... Number of times Roger mentions stuff he has done that has no bearing whatsoever on this case: 45. I'll take the over.

I'm disappointed Steve Phillips just hasn't come out and listed the players he knows took steroids. He knows. He also sucks, but that might be beside the point.

10:07 ET
Roger Clemens enters the room with a pink tie. I wonder if that's a strategic, "trust me" tie.

Couldn't they have put a bigger man in between Roger Clemens and Brian McNamee. This guy couldn't break up a fight between two cats.

Henry Waxman (*giggle*)

Chairman Waxman is setting the stage, giving credence to the Mitchell Report and outlining how the Clemens party objecting to what has been documented against him. Waxman says Congress believes that they owe the Mitchell Report a further investigation with a serious claim against its validity. Blah.

10:15 Chuck Knoblauch in his testimony, agreed with what Brian McNamee provided and even offered up more information about further use on his part. I still can't get over that fact he was a part of this steroid era. Would he or would he have not been near the bottom of your list? The guy couldn't throw 2nd to 1st.

Waxman now details Andy Pettitte's testimony, outlining that he told the committee that Brian McNamee's information was accurate. He also added that he (Pettitte) used HGH again in 2004 to try and recover from an injury. He also alludes to statements about Clemens use that he'll (Waxman) will bring up later. Waxman is really setting the stage, applauding others for telling the truth, and making it clear they expect Roger to commit perjury today.

Waxman: "Their (McNamee/Clemens) testimony couldn't be any more different." "Someone isn't telling the truth."

Waxman did say he expects this will be the last hearing on baseball's past, and on the Mitchell Report. Small victory. Said that he didn't want to have this hearing, but that Roger Clemens attorney thought Roger deserved this public stage.

Waxman is doing a solid job of pointing out the fact that McNamee didn't tell the "entire truth" in the Mitchell Report, should be taken into account when evaluating his credibility. He's now outlining how a lot of what Roger has been saying over the past month isn't entirely adding up. From his 60 minutes conversation, his meetings with Congress, his statements compared to Andy Pettitte's. It's clear that Congress believes Andy 100%.

10:30 Up close shot of Debbie Clemens looking like she's about to boil over. * trying not to laugh *


Waxman continues to compare Roger Clemens statement to Andy Pettitte's and how according to Andy, Roger discussed taking steroids and that later made sure to tell Pettitte that he must have misunderstood, he was talking about Debbie Clemens (his wife) using them. Waxman is finally winding up his 30 minute opening statement, one that has essentially lays out their current opinion that Roger Clemens is the one who is telling the least truth.

Now Representative Tom Davis's opening statement ... good lord.

Actually that was fairly worthwhile. Davis outlines that while this may be ugly, time consuming et al, but they are here to protect the health of young athletes and that is worth everyone's time.

10:45 Roger is on stage ...

Roger speaks very angrily, in the same tone he's spoke for the last month. Points out he speaks that way because wrong claims have been made against him ... steroids are bad, testing should be increased ... I'm not lying ... I'm angry ... nothing new here.

Brian McNamee in his opening statement feels the need to point out his middle name as well as Roger's. Points out that Chuck Knoblauch and Andy Pettitte's testimony corroborated with his own. This is the best defense he has. Hard to believe all these guys are lying.

10:55 Elijay Cummings now has the mic, and it's safe to say he's aggressively going after Clemens. He's detailing how everyone believes Pettitte is an honest man.

Do you think Andy Pettitte is an honest man? Yes.

Andy stated that you discussed taking HGH. Is this true? No.

Cummings asks directly: "Now Mr. Clemens, I'm reminding you that you are under oath. Mr. Clemens do you think Mr. Pettitte was lying when he told the committee that you admitted to using human growth hormones?"

Roger says they were friends before this, and will be friends after this. Roger looking quite hesitant, says Pettitte has been misheard. He doesn't say Andy has lied. He doesn't really answer the question.

Misheard, Misremembered, Misunderstanding ... the words used by Roger so far in regard to Andy Pettitte.

11:00
Cummings is continuing to outline Pettitte's statements, with the help of a fancy projector putting his quotes on a screen above. This statement says Roger told him he used HGH (again) and that it helped his body recover. Cummings outlines Pettitte's wife repeating a similar story.

Roger: Misremembers ... Misremembers ...

It's official: "Misremembers" is the new "I'm not here to talk about the past."

A lot more between Cummings and Roger, but to sum it up. Cummings quotes Andy Pettitte's testimony about Roger admitting HGH use. Asks Roger if he thinks Andy is lying. Roger states his "misremembers."

11:15 Tom Davis now has the mic and is going after McNamee's testimony a bit.

Davis brings up the phone conversation and asks McNamee why he didn't just say "Roger, I told the truth." McNamee responds that by saying "it is what it is" is his jargon for I told the truth.

Is it just me, or do people involved in this steroid conversation have shaky memories. I can tell you roughly what I did 4 years ago and the rough details of important conversations I've had.

Now a party at Jose Canseco's house is being brought up ... can we discuss Jose poor choice of clothing?

I'm sure what this Canseco party has to do with anything, but it appears to be a way for Congress to determine who remembers what and who's lying. I still think this is a bit of waste.

OK, I'm pretty sure I'd remember a party at Jose Canseco's house. That's just me. Roger doesn't remember. Roger also doesn't remember his start the night prior which was a 17 inning game. I can remember my start in the little league world series (of my home town) 14 years ago. I remember the pitchers I throw that got rocked out of the ball park.

11:30 John F. Tierney (Rep from MA) now has the mic ... wants to address each person's honesty. Good luck, buddy.

I like the fact that McNamee is willing to admit he hasn't told the full truth in the past. It still makes his credibility a bit shaky, but shows some genuine truth. It would make sense he felt awful about turning in these players. I know I would.

Tierney points out the Clemens early depositions stated he didn't talk with McNamee at all about human growth hormone. Then in a later statement, outlines a conversation about his wife. The fact Clemens wife is involved in this is truly mind boggling.

Roger dodging another question. Gets advice from his attorney. Still isn't answering the question Tierney is asking about why he was inconsistent with his statements about discussing HGH with Brian McNamee in regards to his wife.

11:45 Dan Burton on stage now questioning Brian McNamee about why he kept the "physical evidence" for so long.

Mr. Burton seems to think it's really ridiculous that McNamee kept this "evidence" on his friend for 5 years. Burton yelps out a "gee-whiz!" I wonder whether Burton got a framed picture of Roger Clemens or just a baseball.

I'm not sure what how U.S. Representatives are supposed to act on this stage, but Burton is the most animated of any. Good to see Roger has at least one congressman on his side. Burton thinks McNamee is a lying fool.

Wow, Burton's being a bit of a jackass. But he is relatively fairly calling out some past lies by Brian McNamee. To McNamee's defense, he has admitted these lies in the past. What should be noted is that Burton hasn't point out anything in McNamee's testimony under oath. That's what she be discussed.

Addressing McNamee ... "this is disgusting ... the only thing I know is who not to believe and that's you." Despite Burton being unprofessional in my opinion, that was the most compelling cross-examining of Brian McNamee to date. +3 Clemens.

I don't think Burton's attack proves a whole lot more than Brian McNamee was trying to cover up HGH and steroid use, just like Bud Selig, but when finally interview by the Mitchell Report he has told the truth. Just not all of it.

12:00 A Stephen Lynch (MA) is on stage ...

Quick recap: Elijay Cummings thinks Clemens is a lier. Dan Burton thinks McNamee is a liar. Everyone thinks its Debbie Clemens is the biggest loser today.

It's worth noting that Brian McNamee's council has never had to whisper into his ear. While Clemens council just interrupted Lynch's line of question to ask if he could discuss with Clemens some issues. In the matter of public opinion, or at least my opinion, this shows me that Roger needs help to dodge a perjury charge while also not telling the truth.

.... nothing of substance ....

... more discussions of faulty memory ... I'm starting to forget this whole congressional hearing as I write. It's spreading.

McNamee just said "butt." hehe

Interesting comment from Jayson Stark of ESPN, who has dealt with Clemens throughout both of their careers: "Rep. John Tierney had an experience many of us in the media have had while trying to interview Clemens: We ask one thing. He gives an answer that seems to be in response to some whole other question. And no matter how hard we try, he keeps answering the question he hears, not the question we asked. Tierney noted three specific times Clemens told investigators he'd never talked to McNamee about HGH -- but then cited two occasions when he confronted McNamee about his injection of his wife with HGH. Repeatedly, Tierney asked Clemens how he "reconciled" that inconsistency. Repeatedly, Clemens gave answers that indicated that "prior" to those conversations, he'd never had a "specific" discussion with McNamee about HGH. You wanted to scream out, "Roger, that's not what he's asking." But eventually, Tierney just gave up and moved on. Been there. Done that."

Here's the sides we have thus far:

Believe McNamee: Waxman, Tierney, Cummings
Believe Clemens: Burton, Davis

12:15 Hey, that third guy in front of Congress Charles Scheeler is getting questioned finally. Scheeler worked with the Mitchell Report.

Paul Kanjorski is attacking the Mitchell Report for essentially not being all-knowing and determining all facts in this case.

Kanjorski claims Scheeler is filibustering, and takes about 2 minutes to explain this. God bless our elected officials.

A Carolyn B. Maloney starts out by saying how proud she is as a New Yorker of Roger Clemens professional achievements. Read: Thank you for your signed autographs, my kids appreciated them tremendously.

Maloney asks one of the most relative questions thus far (paraphrasing): "Why didn't you speak with Sen. George Mitchell? You denied ever knowing about the Mitchell investigation but in your 60 minutes interview you said you denied a request from Mitchell because of your council."

Clemens sort of confirms his original stance that he knew nothing about the Mitchell Report and that he was never contacted. If he had known what was going to be held against him, he would have wanted to talk.

12:30 Rep. John Mica is on and he wants to talk colors.

McNamee points out that Winstrol is a powdery white. Testosterone is oily and honey-colored. HGH, when added to water, was clear. Clemens responds in a question that B-12 was red or pink. I had no idea where Mica was going with this, but that's a rather large difference, one that you'd think two people wouldn't remember differently.

A Mark Souder is now on stage and immediately expresses his disappointment with the hearing, and that he wanted Chuck Knoblauch and Andy Pettitte to be present as well.

Souder (applause) thinks baseball's ownership needs to be under a closer microscope for covering up the steroid era. Hooray! Thank you. While the players need to be held accountable, I firmly believe it's baseball's ownership is the most to blame for their encouragement of this environment.

Mr. Souder gets it. He's single-handedly re-established my faith in our elected officials. Or at least there's a few good, intelligent guys (and girls) up there. Hopefully I'll have some audio, video or a write up of his entire segment.

WM. Lacy Clay is at the mic ...

Roger is being allowed to discuss his career and upbringing and where his work ethic came from. Points out he had 200 wins before he met Brian McNamee. That's all well and good. I think Roger works hard, and that he's a great pitcher. But that doesn't take away from the possibility that he took HGH in the early 2000s.

Clay wastes our time by asking what jersey Roger Clemens will wear into the HOF. Clay unfortunately has played his card that he's a big Roger fan and so are his kids. Disgusting.

12:45 Waxman gets his turn. This could be good.

More of Clemens council giving him advice.

Clemens lawyers quite adamantly objecting this discussion about his nanny. After 7 years of not speaking, Clemens clearly (to me) tried to discuss with the nanny potential questioning by the committee before they got to her. Odd, right? Could be nothing, of course, but the angry and abrupt reaction of his lawyers tells me this has some merit. When Dan Burton was attacking Brian McNamee quite unprofessionally, his council allowed him to carry on.

Clemens is hurt that Waxman would insinuate that he would influence his nanny's comments. Aww.

Rep. Eleanor Holmes Norton gets her turn.

Her main question was why did you continue to employ Brian McNamee. To which Roger Clemens in what's becoming his roundabout way, that he's a forgiving man.

Norton finishes her turn by saying, "Roger, I'm sure you're going to heaven."

15 minute break. I may or may not return to live blogging.

p.s. New term: Nanny-Gate.

1:30 We're back underway, I'll post if there's anything worthy of noting but I have a feeling it will just be a repeat of what has happened above. Trying to get each person to admit to a lie.

I'm not entirely surprised that McNamee has a shady past. After all, he was a supplier of illegal substances. Did anyone suspect he'd be an upstanding man?

1:45 Rep. Issa with a money quote: "PHD must stand for Piled Higher and Deeper" with respect to how McNamee has somehow acquired the title.

2:10 Rep. Virginia Foxx gets on her soap box as so many others have and says she thinks this is in an inappropriate use of this committees time, yada yada. Read: I am not a fan of baseball.

2:30 Still going on. One thought here that I'm having trouble with in regard to believing Clemens: how is it possible that Andy Pettitte took HGH without Roger knowing anything at all. I don't believe that.

Rep. Elijah Cummings has said it best: "You're one of my hero's, but I'm having trouble believing you." Other than calling Clemens a hero, insert appreciate your talents, and that's pretty much how I feel.

Good to see there are 5 congressman who are in the room right now.

It's getting a little unorganized and restless in the room. Let's hope this ends soon.

Oh great, another story about Roger Clemens life and how he helped kids.

Mercifully, it's over. If you were to score this "fight," who do you believe won?
45 comments
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Your votes determine top comment

2/13/08
4
I think they are both lying and both telling the truth to varying degrees. I still don't know what to believe, and honestly, I'm so sick of this whole thing I don't care anymore. A lot of players used. It sucked that it was such a huge part of baseball. Now let's move on.

2/13/08
0
I was wondering last night if you'd be doing a live thread for this. I'm kinda glad you are b/c right now I don't think I can bring myself to actually watch/listen to it myself (I may change my mind later).

2/13/08
1
Oh, and as for your question CF... I do find it troublesome that Clemens was meeting individually with committee members last week. That kinds of conduct is totally inappropriate from both ends.

2/13/08
2
CF can't we just talk about the dog show last night... I mean did you see that Beagle?  Freaking awesome!

2/13/08
2
Fat wrote:
CF can't we just talk about the dog show last night... I mean did you see that Beagle?  Freaking awesome!
I just like the fact his name was Uno. A beagle named Uno.

2/13/08
2
Thought this might be of interest to some of you... last night, California Congressman Darrell Issa was on the Michael Kay Show on 1050 ESPN Radio. The Congressman says he thinks the Mitchell Report is mearly to get media attention. The Congressman also comments that there is better ways to spend the taxpayers money than have this investigation in congress right now.

So it seems not all the committee members are on board for what should prove to be a colossal waste of our tax dollars.

Here's the audio of the interview: Congressman Darrell Issa interviewed on the Michael Kay Show

2/13/08
0
JewelOfSong wrote:
Thought this might be of interest to some of you... last night, California Congressman Darrell Issa was on the Michael Kay Show on 1050 ESPN Radio. The Congressman says he thinks the Mitchell Report is mearly to get media attention. The Congressman also comments that there is better ways to spend the taxpayers money than have this investigation in congress right now.

So it seems not all the committee members are on board for what should prove to be a colossal waste of our tax dollars.

Here's the audio of the interview: Congressman Darrell Issa interviewed on the Michael Kay Show
Thanks.

I do think this is worth congresses attention ... but maybe not right now.

2/13/08
0
CriticalFanatic wrote:
Thanks.

I do think this is worth congresses attention ... but maybe not right now.
I think the initial hearing 2005 and the follow-up last month were necessary, especially considering baseball's anti-trust exempt status. But to go after individual players... I don't see what the endgame is here other than for committee members to be in the spotlight.

2/13/08
1
JewelOfSong wrote:
I think the initial hearing 2005 and the follow-up last month were necessary, especially considering baseball's anti-trust exempt status. But to go after individual players... I don't see what the endgame is here other than for committee members to be in the spotlight.
I think there's something to show young athletes that it's not worth it and all this public scrutiny is part of that message. Fair or unfair.

2/13/08
1
CriticalFanatic wrote:
I think there's something to show young athletes that it's not worth it and all this public scrutiny is part of that message. Fair or unfair.
Good point. I just hope that doesn't get lost in all the proceedings today.

2/13/08
0
So exciting, but have to go to class.

Bummer.

2/13/08
0

I think if Roger would have manned up and admitted to this before the Mitchell Report this would not even be an issue right now(as far as individuals). People would have had their opinions (good and bad) but the worst part of it would have been over(until Hall voting came around for him that is).

 

If he did not take them then they need to really find out who is lying.

 

I believe Roger took them and everyday he hides from the truth (whether it comes out here or not) he is only hurting his own legacy and name.

 

 

CF do you really think that Congress is going to get the real truth out of this?


2/13/08
0
kappafla211 wrote:

I think if Roger would have manned up and admitted to this before the Mitchell Report this would not even be an issue right now(as far as individuals). People would have had their opinions (good and bad) but the worst part of it would have been over(until Hall voting came around for him that is).

 

If he did not take them then they need to really find out who is lying.

 

I believe Roger took them and everyday he hides from the truth (whether it comes out here or not) he is only hurting his own legacy and name.

 

 

CF do you really think that Congress is going to get the real truth out of this?

It's doubtful they'll get one of these two to admit they were lying ... but I do think this public stage confirms what the public already views as the truth.

2/13/08
0

Unfortunately Bonds and Clemens are the only two hiding from the issue of the truth(and they are two of the biggest names involved with this era and baseball). But instead they use words to sound like they are proactive in fighting steroid abuse. They hide behind anger and words. But until there is actual evidence like receipts, video tapes, multiple witnesses it is all just accusations. Needles, syringes, bloody gauze, and etc. can all be tampered with after the fact.

 


2/13/08
0
How long is this hearing supposed go on?

2/13/08
0
It appears that way.

2/13/08
0

best line so far has been from McNamee:

 

"I told the investigators I injected three people -- two of whom I know confirmed my account. The third is sitting at this table."


2/13/08
0
Agreed. It's apparently good enough evidence, because it's pissing the hell out of the lawyers.

2/13/08
2
CriticalFanatic wrote:
Agreed. It's apparently good enough evidence, because it's pissing the hell out of the lawyers.
What I found to be kind of odd is that so many committee memebrs questioned both Clemens and McNamee about this party at Canseco's... and only toward the end (right before the break), did the Chairman bring into evidence the phone interview with the nanny.

Also, in the grand scheme of things, this party really doesn't mean a whole lot. There was no PED use or sale, so why so much focus on said party?

2/13/08
0
Thanks for live-blogging this CF.  Now I'm all caught up.  Its clear from what you have up there that Clemens is hiding something.  He's got to start regretting not admitting the truth from the start.

2/13/08
0
JewelOfSong wrote:
What I found to be kind of odd is that so many committee memebrs questioned both Clemens and McNamee about this party at Canseco's... and only toward the end (right before the break), did the Chairman bring into evidence the phone interview with the nanny.

Also, in the grand scheme of things, this party really doesn't mean a whole lot. There was no PED use or sale, so why so much focus on said party?
I think its more perception that anything.  If you can prove Clemens was there, what else might he be hiding?

2/13/08
0
kantwistaye wrote:
Thanks for live-blogging this CF.  Now I'm all caught up.  Its clear from what you have up there that Clemens is hiding something.  He's got to start regretting not admitting the truth from the start.
Clemens is definitely hiding something, but he's winning in one way and that's that the committee has basically proven that McNamee isn't the most truthful person. But it was a matter of McNamee wanting to protect his friends and clients than anything else.

2/13/08
1

I don't know how Clemens normally acts when he talks, but when somebody is lying they have a tendency to squirm around and avoid eye contact.  Clemens has been doing that the whole time I've been watching.  McNamee hasn't had that, at least while I'm watching. 


2/13/08
0
Our Congress is really out of touch if they're blown away by "It is what it is."

2/13/08
1
(Edited by kappafla211)

My best photo so far is:

 

 

 

One of these guys is a liar but both stand in front of our government and is willing to lift their right hand and swear to tell the truth. Then continues to lie in front of them.

 

*Slap* *Slap*

 

"Ouch"

J. M. Flagg's Uncle Sam recruited soldiers for . 


2/13/08
0
I'm sure Pettitte would have showed if they asked him to come. He asked to be excused from the hearing the other day, and Waxman and Davis recommended to the committee that he, Knoblauch, and Radomski be excused... that their depositions were enough. Radomski was just going to invoke the 5th amendment anyway so as to avoid further incriminating himself.

2/13/08
4
I think they are both lying and both telling the truth to varying degrees. I still don't know what to believe, and honestly, I'm so sick of this whole thing I don't care anymore. A lot of players used. It sucked that it was such a huge part of baseball. Now let's move on.

2/13/08
0
JewelOfSong wrote:
I think they are both lying and both telling the truth to varying degrees. I still don't know what to believe, and honestly, I'm so sick of this whole thing I don't care anymore. A lot of players used. It sucked that it was such a huge part of baseball. Now let's move on.
I think it is important to find out the truth in this case, if possible, but I'm so glad that Spring Training is starting this week and we will slowly move on.

If it wasn't for Andy Pettitte and Chuck Knoblauch agreeing with Brian McNamee's testimony, then I'd be on Roger Clemens side. The way it stands now, I can't imagine those two lying and Clemens on his own.

2/13/08
0
So I just saw the closing statement from Waxman, and Clemen's reaction is classic. Nothing but extreme arrogance from him. Maybe Walton should've saved his line for Clemens instead of Shaq.  McNamee looks a lot better than Clemens right now, especially since Clemens is placing the blame on his wife and best friend.  Stay classy Roger!

2/13/08
0
After hearing the highlights on Sportscenter, honestly I don't trust EITHER of them.  They both seem like they're lying.

The winner in this all is Roger Goodell, who conveniently chose this day to talk to Specter, so the spygate stuff is ignored.

2/13/08
2
MrNFL wrote:
After hearing the highlights on Sportscenter, honestly I don't trust EITHER of them.  They both seem like they're lying.

The winner in this all is Roger Goodell, who conveniently chose this day to talk to Specter, so the spygate stuff is ignored.
What is this Spygate stuff you speak of?

2/14/08
2
I was going to put something but I misremembered what I was going to put.

2/14/08
0
Jubanator14 wrote:
I was going to put something but I misremembered what I was going to put.
lol... I learned something new yesterday: "misremember" is in fact a word :P

I wonder, is it a Texan thing to use that word? B/c I have never heard it before.

 
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