The NFL - Where better living through chemistry happens.

I agree that athlete's are more "freakish" today because the advancements in sports medicine, sports nutrition and sports training. Hell if I had the availability to the stuff I take today (and all I do is just the GNC stuff) I might actually seen the playing field.

I do think though the NFL and the players still have to work on the issue of PED's and what should be allowed and not allowed. The can not go the MLB route. Make things as level and transparent as possible, while also having something that will look out for players health.

I know one of the big issues is the use of HGH. Which I at first felt was an unfair advantage but after reading an article in ESPN the Rag a while back that talked about the case for allowing HGH, " I have kind of change my position.

Lastly, does my comment make any sense?

OK..I have two issues with this post.

1.)  The Mitchell Report did absolutely nothing to "clean up" baseball.  It clearly names players who were alledgedly using performance enhancing drugs in MLB prior to any kind of testing or rules stating that it was not allowed.  The Mitchell Report effectively wasted tax payer money and ruined the reputation of good ball players who may never be able to get in to the hall of fame now.  In the case of Roger Clemens, the Mitchell Report has brought out stories and accusations that he juiced up his wife for a photo shoot and that he slept with a 15 year old girl while he was married.  C'Mon guys.  I go to the park to watch guys like Clemens, Smoltz, Maddux and Schilling throw a ball at a guy like Bonds (preferably his head), Rose, Ripken and Griffey to see if they can hit it.  The Mitchell Report in my mind has tarnished that past time for me.  I don't care what those guys do in their spare time and that some jacka$$ in Washington thinks they should not be a role model for my kids.....well if they hadn't dug into the personal lives of all these ball players we still wouldn't know.  They made it illegal and they stopped doing it which was obvious by the numbers that many of them put up in the years following the the ban on PED's.  We would still be going to the games and watching the same matchups hoping that Barry Bonds would eventually stop being an a$$hole and actually talk to the media.  Of course, I hate the fact that they cheated baseball, but honestly how many of the guys in the Mitchell Report would you have fingered for PED's prior to reading the names??

2.)  I have to agree with the posts here that talk about kids today being bigger and better for some reason.  In my hometown of just left of middle of nowhere, TX I have noticed that the kids are bigger, faster and stronger than they were when I was in school.  My two oldest boys are now starting to get into the sports world and I think I am noticing part of what is going on these days.  When I was a kid (1970's), they didn't play organized tackle football until you were 12 years old.  You played for two years and then played for the middles school team.  Now they start playing at 7 and have three or four different weight and age groups to play in.  Not only that, but the high school and college coaches are holding summer camps and mini-camps to teach the players how to eat, run, lift weights and start working on techniques.  They are also doing this in baseball.  I think it is great...It is expensive as all get out, but my boys are much better at 9 and 11 than I was at that age and I was fortunate enough to play baseball and football at the college level.  And in disagreement with the statements about marrying athletes that is not really the only reason.  My wife was a slacker and lazy dope smokin' fine thang that was in the band.

Not a bad start, but where is the reasoning and argument to convince me?  That comment is like saying that Mickey Mouse would be a better candidate for US President in 2008 than the three front running candidates we have now without giving you any reasons to beleive it yourself.

Well maybe it's not the same.  That one is pretty beleivable.

Guys and girls.  I played college football and a buddy of mine played several years in the NFL for the Lions, Falcons and Broncos (he actually went to 2 Super Bowls).  Neither of us ever took any kind of PED while in high school or college and he tells me that he never took anything while playing professionally.  I have to beleive him since he is my friend but you guys can make of that what you want to.  In High School this guy was 6'6 and weighed 185 pounds.  He played TE and LB in High School.  I was 6'1 and weighed 190 in High School and played OG and LB.  In the summer before our freshmen year in colege the coaches gave us a strict workout plan and a strict diet to follow.  My friend played as a freshman at 6'6 and 245 pounds.  And I came in at 6'1 and 260.  Unfortunately, I never made it to the professional level so this is where my comparison ends. However, my friend played professionally for 11 years and finished his career at 6'6 and 315 pounds.

I can honestly say that with the drug testing policies in college sports and now in professional sports, it is very difficult to sneak any kind of steroids past anybody.  They are even starting to test at the High School level.  I do not disagree with the fact that there is probably a large number of players that have used PED's in the past and could make up their own Mitchell Report of who dunnits from 10 years ago...but you would have a very small list going forward.

Where the heck were you playing?  I played at a small university barely in D-1 nearly 20 years ago, and there WERE steroids in that locker room!  Several guys that took them made the NFL (Hell, one of them is going in NFL HOF, but, in his defense, I only heard of him taking 'roids to get well after he had a very serious car wreck in the off-season).  I knew guys who played in the SEC and ACC who told me that the 'roids were around there too, and - I repeat-- this was nearly 20 years ago.  I stayed clean, so I have no doubt that you and your friend did too, but there were tons (literally!) of guys who did not.  I don't share your optimism about the testing either.  As I understand it, the tests have to be looking for a specific steroid.  As a chemist need only add an extra molecule to a steroid's chemical mixture to beat the tests, I am not sure that we can effectively screen them out.  Certainly at least ONE poster here on the Q has a chemistry degree and can explain the new testing or circumventing the new testing to us - in layman's terms, of course.

Please allow me to clarify....I did not say that the PED's and 'roids were not around.  I too played 20 years ago and it was at a major university.  The drugs were in the locker room and readily available if someone so desired. 

I guess my comment was more in response to the fact that I assumed this thread was leaning toward the fact that everybody that made it to the professional level that was ripped or over 300 pounds was using.  I completely and whole heartedly disagree.

And agreed, tests can be beaten but it is getting more difficult to do so and the tricks that were used 20 years ago no longer work.  As you mentioned it is getting more into the chemical manipulation of the drugs and such.