Tim Tebow will be the Broncos starter next year, according to John Elway

John Elway names Tebow the 2012 starter, sets the Broncos back 3-5 years

1/17/12 in NFL   |   Pat   |   5229 respect

Some people will tell you Tim Tebow is a gamer, a baller, a playmaker and a shot-caller, and all he does is win games.

Others will offer a more analytical view, and tell you that, quite frankly, he's just not that good.

Broncos team president John Elway has been straddling the fence all year, waffling back and forth on whether or not Tebow is the QB of the future in Denver or not.

He's done flip flopping, though.

"I think Tim has earned the right to be the starting quarterback going into training camp next year. I think that he made some good strides this year. He obviously played very well against Pittsburgh and played very well in a lot of football games."

Elway needs to be careful, however, about how much he commits to Tebow. His style of play isn't the only thing that makes him unlike any other quarterback. The way you treat him must be different as well.

Running quarterbacks tend to get hurt more often than traditional, pass-first QBs. This is why the Eagles signed Vince Young to be Michael Vick's backup in Philadelphia. He was the most similar QB to Vick that they could find to back him up. That way, in the event that Vick got hurt (and he did), they wouldn't have to drastically change the entire playbook for Young.

The only way the Broncos can have a comparable backup for Tebow is if they draft (or sign) a spread-option QB. Generally, like Tebow, these quarterbacks have little to no experience in a pro-style offense.

Additionally, the Broncos have to adapt their entire offensive playbook to fit Tebow's skills and weaknesses. They can't run the same thing that other teams run, because Tim Tebow can't run the same offense as everyone else in the league. Get ready for a lot of option plays, QB draws and handoffs.

Once they adapt their entire offense to fit Tebow, it will be time to see if a gimmick offense can even be effective on a long term basis. Based on what we saw against the Patriots, the only decent team with 2 cracks at stopping Tebow... let's just say I don't think his "success" is going to last.

If the Broncos stick with this and actually commit 100% to Tim Tebow as their starter, it will set the franchise back 3-5 years, as I stated in the title. Sure, they got to the playoffs this year, but anyone who thinks it was anything but a freak set of circumstances is only fooling himself.

Consider this:
  • The Broncos backed into the playoffs with an 8-8 record, and losses in their last 3 games.
  • Tebow was rendered absolutely ineffective against the Patriots, who had one of the worst defenses in the entire NFL
  • The didn't beat a single winning team in the regular season. Their "best" wins were against the Jets, Raiders, Bears and Chargers, who were all 8-8 in the regular season.
  • Even their playoff win, against the Steelers, was against a bad team. Yes, a bad team. With as many injuries as the Steelers had, they were a shell of their normal self. And it showed. Not to mention the horrible game plan.
  • Tebow finished the season with a 46.5% completion percentage. That's 4.3% worse than Blaine Gabbert, who had the 2nd lowest percentage in the league.
  • Out of the Broncos' 13 games with Tebow at the helm, they scored 18 points or less 9 times.
  • They finished 25th in scoring offense, averaging only 19.3 points per game. And that's after averaging 20.2 points per game in the first 5 games with Kyle Orton, so Tebow brought the average down.

By sticking with Tebow, they're prolonging the inevitable. They need a legitimate NFL QB, and they're not going to go anywhere until they get one. It's that simple. Tebow isn't the answer, no matter how bad the fans want him to be.

If John Elway actually follows through with this, the only thing saving his job will be the fact that he's John Elway, the greatest player in Denver history. Because on the field, the team will be a mess until he makes the right call and gets a quarterback. Take that to the bank.
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1/22/12   |   kramer   |   11004 respect

scquwi1 wrote:

I will give you 6 not Ben,  players play hurt all the time. The Broncos were without Dawkins, Thomas,  Kuper, Larsen, and  Decker went out in the 1st qrt. So the Steelers had 6 starters and the Broncos had 5 then you talk about Ben, well I am sure you are like most who believe Tebow cannot play in the NFL or make the throws he needs. So the worst you are going to get is they are even. Now lets go one step further Pouncey was out and replaced by Legursky right there you are still getting someone who is capable of playing he proved it last year in the Super Bowl against the Packers. So your lost in not as bad as you make it out, and now the injured players are what look 5 for the Steelers and 5 for the Broncos. So again the Steelers still had better weapons and both teams had injuries and even with that the Steelers had better replacement players for the injured ones.  

so yes I am saying do not go there saying we had injuries and that's why we lost, you are not the Colts and you did not lose Peyton. The Texans made it using Yates, and had many other injuries during the season. It happens.  And no I am not going to get into a drag out debate about this.

I said it was a reason but not the SOLE reason.  I've also been over this game for two weeks.  Thank you for not beating a dead horse.

1/22/12   |   scquwi1   |   1227 respect

kramer wrote:
So wait, we're making the argument that injuries to half your team is not a valid excuse for losing?  Let's see...

Ryan Clark - would die if he played in Denver with the high altitude and his sickle-cell
Big Ben - hobbling around for a month and could not get out of the pocket and extend the play like he usually does
Maurkice Pouncey - replaced by Doug Legursky due to injury
Rashard Mendenhall - non-contact ACL tear the week prior in Cleveland
Casey Hampton, Brett Kiesel, Lamar Woodley - all injured and sideline for the rest of the game in Denver within a 10-minute period

That's 7 starters there.  Yes, Ben does have better offensive weapons, but when he's too gimpy to actually plant his left foot to throw, the whole offense becomes virtually inept.

I will give you 6 not Ben,  players play hurt all the time. The Broncos were without Dawkins, Thomas,  Kuper, Larsen, and  Decker went out in the 1st qrt. So the Steelers had 6 starters and the Broncos had 5 then you talk about Ben, well I am sure you are like most who believe Tebow cannot play in the NFL or make the throws he needs. So the worst you are going to get is they are even. Now lets go one step further Pouncey was out and replaced by Legursky right there you are still getting someone who is capable of playing he proved it last year in the Super Bowl against the Packers. So your lost in not as bad as you make it out, and now the injured players are what look 5 for the Steelers and 5 for the Broncos. So again the Steelers still had better weapons and both teams had injuries and even with that the Steelers had better replacement players for the injured ones.  

so yes I am saying do not go there saying we had injuries and that's why we lost, you are not the Colts and you did not lose Peyton. The Texans made it using Yates, and had many other injuries during the season. It happens.  And no I am not going to get into a drag out debate about this.

1/20/12   |   kramer   |   11004 respect

kobe_lova wrote:
Okay then.


P.S. I hate to blame Mike Tomlin but stubborn or not, that decision should've been made FOR Ben.

One of the local talk show hosts actually said after the San Fran game that someone should hide Ben's helmet or throw it into the Allegheny River.

1/20/12   |   Pat   |   5229 respect

kobe_lova wrote:
Okay then.


P.S. I hate to blame Mike Tomlin but stubborn or not, that decision should've been made FOR Ben.

Very true. I actually think Tomlin is a very good coach, and I respect the way he handled the Ryan Clark situation, but he really screwed up by letting Ben dictate whether or not he would play. It's obvious that he wasn't able to help the team, and I really think they could have beaten the Broncos with a healthy Charlie Batch, or whoever would have replaced him.

1/20/12   |   kobe_lova   |   61187 respect

kramer wrote:
He's stubborn as a mule and determined as all hell, but he should've rested the last 3 weeks of the regular season.  He was gimpy for a month and would not take a back seat.  The 3 D-linemen were all injured during the 2nd quarter, and started dropping like flies.  I'm not saying injuries are the sole excuse, but they did play a huge part, especially when your QB is too damn stubborn to admit what everyone watching the game can clearly see.

Okay then.


P.S. I hate to blame Mike Tomlin but stubborn or not, that decision should've been made FOR Ben.

1/19/12   |   kramer   |   11004 respect

kobe_lova wrote:
I'm thinking that the injuries count in the sense that they obviously affected those games, but I think making that the sole excuse for why they didn't win winnable games is what bugs people. I understand why Ryan Clark couldn't play, it was a good decision and they can win without him. Even with all of those injuries, they should've won, IMO. If Ben was that hurt, they should've taken him out. He was obviously, by your words, hurting more than helping.

Injuries? Texans... no excuses. Case closed.

/my two cents

He's stubborn as a mule and determined as all hell, but he should've rested the last 3 weeks of the regular season.  He was gimpy for a month and would not take a back seat.  The 3 D-linemen were all injured during the 2nd quarter, and started dropping like flies.  I'm not saying injuries are the sole excuse, but they did play a huge part, especially when your QB is too damn stubborn to admit what everyone watching the game can clearly see.

1/19/12   |   kobe_lova   |   61187 respect

I'm thinking that the injuries count in the sense that they obviously affected those games, but I think making that the sole excuse for why they didn't win winnable games is what bugs people. I understand why Ryan Clark couldn't play, it was a good decision and they can win without him. Even with all of those injuries, they should've won, IMO. If Ben was that hurt, they should've taken him out. He was obviously, by your words, hurting more than helping.

Injuries? Texans... no excuses. Case closed.

/my two cents

1/19/12   |   kramer   |   11004 respect

scquwi1 wrote:
Ok wait first the Patriots had #17 rush defense which is what Jon Fox is know for running. So instead of going after their weakness the Broncos played into the Patriots strenghts.

Saying it is the only thing Tebow could do is again wrong, look when he was under McDaniels he threw the ball and know one was claiming he could not throw in the league. Instead people said he could, then this year Fox change it to help Tebow. No way he sent it up thinking the Broncos would lose the first two games under Tebow and when they did not little by little they change the offense. Newton ran more of option offense this year so that is a good argument.

Tebow 46.5% is lower then Blaine Gabbert, WOW really you are going with that. Elway's was 47.5% his was below Blaine Gabberts too. Proves nothing another weak stat. Ok so you have a 1 point difference (NOT EVEN A POINT)  between what the team score with Orton and Tebow so you show that the Broncos score just as much with Tebow as they did with Orton.

Bad Steelers team  true you had injuries still lets put the teams side by side and the Broncos still have the worst of the two teams. Do not make excuses for the lost. The Broncos lost their #1 receiver Eric Decker (who has been in the league for 2 years) and had to go with Thomas as a #1 and the Broncos had no TEs. There is not a real #1 on that team.

 It is laughable again you bringing up the Broncos were 25th in scoring when the Steelers were tied for 21st. They out scores the Broncos by 16 points. Wow that says a lot more when you look at the receivers and backs for the Broncos compared to the Steelers and the Broncos were only 16 points behind. The Steelers had way more weapons on offensive. 

The defensive only played great against teams with had a weak offense, the Raiders just got Palmer and the Chargers just found ways to lose. The Bears, Jets, and Raiders were above .500 when the Broncos meet them and beat. After  that game each of those teams had their future in their hands and could have made it to the playoffs. Saying they were 8-8 in not a good point the Giants were 9-7 and one game from the Super Bowl. you can go back and said look at the teams they lost too. That is why they play 16 games and those who want it and have the talent move on.

You like 99% of fans and even the experts not one time go though the game and see all the drop passes (Which the Broncos lead the league), the o-line break down and when Tebow does scramble the receivers mostly were cover. Look at the NE games 95% of the time the receivers were covered. Then they do not go and fight for the balls. Break it down and see how receivers go after under throw and up to get the pass, compare to Rodgers, Brees, Brady, Manning's receivers. Look at Rodgers when he receivers dropped passes against the Giants, he was losing it on the field and that was an every game thing for Tebow.

Love Billywa joke, throw shorter passes, wow to bad the Broncos do not call for short pass routes. instead they go for the longer ones. no wonder Tebow % is low look at Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Manning they all have short passes to get in rhythm.

All of you who think Tebow will not be around and think he is a bust I would bet thought Alex Smith was a bust too. Look what happens when you bring in a real coach who can call plays and bring a team together. If the Broncos go out get a TE or 2, the O-line will get better


Oh yeah I hear it a lot that Fox and Elway gave in to the fans to play Tebow, if this is true do you really want them to run the team and think that their decisions are whats best for this team? Come on you know you would not want that, instead you would want a coach and GM to play those they think will give them the best shot at winning. It has been said Elway wanted Tebow to start  from the beginning to see what they had and it was Fox who was against it. That would seem more logical then to think that Elway said oh wait the fans want him lets put him in Jon.

So wait, we're making the argument that injuries to half your team is not a valid excuse for losing?  Let's see...

Ryan Clark - would die if he played in Denver with the high altitude and his sickle-cell
Big Ben - hobbling around for a month and could not get out of the pocket and extend the play like he usually does
Maurkice Pouncey - replaced by Doug Legursky due to injury
Rashard Mendenhall - non-contact ACL tear the week prior in Cleveland
Casey Hampton, Brett Kiesel, Lamar Woodley - all injured and sideline for the rest of the game in Denver within a 10-minute period

That's 7 starters there.  Yes, Ben does have better offensive weapons, but when he's too gimpy to actually plant his left foot to throw, the whole offense becomes virtually inept.

1/19/12   |   Beaneaters   |   17652 respect

Are we suppose to guess the number in between the 3 and the 5?

1/18/12   |   scquwi1   |   1227 respect

1) Please what a lame excuse the bears had a better secondary and Tebow threw 191 yards in the 4th quarter alone when Coach Fox finally allowed it. So you cannot sit here and say Fox knew Tebow could not pass against them. BTW his break out game would have been against the Texans in his 1st year. Good tire though.

2) Yeah Fox won those games you are right I seen him out there making plays. Lets run and run even though it is not working. Oh well, middle of the third quarter why don't we pass the ball. Yeah great coaching there.

3) Miss Decker and Thomas yeah I saw those just as I said them drop passes in every game or the balls that where throw up they became a fan and just watch the play happen. Please do not go there Decker is not a #1 receiver on any team and would not be a #2 on most. Thomas made a lot of mistakes but is getting better. So stay away from the missing Decker (healthy or not) because there is more film on him letting balls drop and not going after the balls which makes your top receivers what they are play makers.

4) When you are a QB on a team that leads the league in drop passes (BRONCOS) you will see more mistakes by the QB because he does not have the faith in his receivers so missing short yeah I see it. It is why he was gun shy and Elway said just pull the trigger have more faith in your receivers.

5) Wow really throwing 2890 in his second year  is a bust. granted his third he was not great and Mike Singletary took over the next season but he was all ready a back up. We seen how the 9ers played under Mike a big difference between him and Jim. No one said he should have started right away wold have done him good to be a backup like Rodgers but no he did not have that luxury.  I am a bust funny your lack of knowledge and understand how evaluate players and game film makes you the weakest link. Thank you for playing. Good Bye!!

1/18/12   |   Joe_L   |   12371 respect

See Pat, I told you so.

1/18/12   |   kantwistaye   |   4210 respect

scquwi1 wrote:

1) wow you are right they were 17 and it would be stupid to run and what did the Broncos do.... RUN... that was Jon foxes great plan to run the ball. In this game like all the other the Broncos passed more in the second half.

2) Break it down barney style for you. Under McDaniel's system Tebow was not in a run first or option offense. Then Fox comes in and all of sudden "We have to change everything for him" It is a bunch a bull.

3) yes I am you need to go back and look QB have about the same passing % then and now. Wait how many games did Tebow start his rookie season??? That's right 3 with a coach who would let him throw and had a 50% passing rate. With John Fox his % dropped in I will say first full season only cause he played in 11 games (not to include the playoffs)

4) Thinking he is overrated compared to cannot play when Ben has way more weapons is a big difference.

5) the team was not overrated the defense was. Get rid of those who believe Tebow wins games by himself no one gives credit to the offensive instead all you hear is the defensive is so great. The Broncos team is a sorry team that is what made them so fun to talk and watch because they found a way to beat teams. Half the teams with above average defense and record when they played with less talented players.

Wow no respect for his passing because they know Fox is not going to call for a pass, it is why the Steelers got burned on the pass to Thomas. Only once that game did they throw on first down. I would not respect your passing game. The Bears, Jets, Dolphins thought the same thing till they let Tebow pass (from the pocket) and got beat. He also threw from the pocket in his three starts his rookie season. To say he cannot throw from the pocket was the same garbage I heard about Steve Young in Tampa. Did pretty good in San Fran when he had players and the right schemes to throw in.

No I have see them and I am not saying they cannot throw deep, what I said they throw a ton more short passes which sets up the long. You really to look how many times on the long passes the receivers save Brady, Brees and Rodgers. A lot of under thrown or off target where the receivers go and get with the nice extendsion. Look at the TDs Brady thrown against the Broncos. Even the one to Branch. Branch had to slow down and caught in on the back shoulder, closer to the defender. If that was the Broncos especially Decker he would not have slow down and all we would hear Tebow under threw. TAPE DOES NOT LIE.

8) Smith a bust???? I will go with they said the same thing about Young in Tampa, had a change of coaches and now look he is in the HoF. I am not saying Smith will be a Hofer but people are quick to judge and all the problem was the leadership on the team was not putting the players in schemes to succeed.

1) Because John Fox knew that as bad as the Patriots secondary is, Tebow still can't pass against them.  Even in Tebow's "breakout game" he completed less than half of his passes.

2) Because John Fox knew that was the only way his team could win. Tebow was still awful in a system catered exactly to him, but Fox managed it to 8 wins. If not for Jim Harbaugh, Fox is probably coach of the year.

3) Um, okay. Elway was still significantly better. The fact you even make that comparison show's how out of touch you are with reality, but whatever.

4) True, Big Ben has more weapons. Tebow also has a future star in Thomas, a great running game, and the #4 defense in the league. Those things are pretty damn nice too.

5) Have you seen how badly Tim Tebow misses Eric Decker (when he weas healthy) and Thomas on deep passes.  Also, the running game sets up deep passes just as much if not more than short passes. Tebow is bad on deep passes because he's bad.

6) And really man? This is Alex Smith's 7th year. This and the next 2-3 will be his best.  Its the first time he topped 3,000 yards, 7.0 YPA, and a 85.0 QB Rating.  If you're the 1st overall pick of the draft and it takes you this long to finally do that (and in a year where passing numbers are absurdly high) you're a bust. 

1/18/12   |   scquwi1   |   1227 respect

kantwistaye wrote:
1) Pats had 17th ranked rush defense because their secondary was so bad you'd be stupid to run against them. Also, you had to pass to keep up with Tom Brady.

2) Huh?

3) You're comparing 1983 to 2011-12.  Passing percentages are considerably higher in this age. Also, you're comparing Elway's rookie year to Tebow's second. In Elway's second year he completed 56.3% of his passes. Almost 10% better in a tougher passing era.

4) Pat also thinks Ben Roethlisberger is overrated. So..

5) The weak schedule means the entire team was overrated. Regardless, the defense was clearly the strenght of the team.  The regression to the mean next year will be rough.

6) Dude, Tim Tebow had no pocket presence what so ever and was far better on the run than in the pocket.  He was better on the run because the defense never respect his passing ability and, to his credit, he sometimes made teams pay big by hitting Thomas who is a beast in the open field after the catch.  Rodgers, Brees, Brady, and Manning do have better recievers, but those recievers don't make the 20% difference in completion percentage.

7) I take it you rarely watch Brady, Rodgers, and Brees.  Their deep passes are things of beauty.

8) Alex Smith is still a bust.  Two very good drives don't make a career.  He's still a below average QB and he's in his prime now.  Give the guy credit for showing up in the biggest moment of his career, but it doesn't change his body of work.

1) wow you are right they were 17 and it would be stupid to run and what did the Broncos do.... RUN... that was Jon foxes great plan to run the ball. In this game like all the other the Broncos passed more in the second half.

2) Break it down barney style for you. Under McDaniel's system Tebow was not in a run first or option offense. Then Fox comes in and all of sudden "We have to change everything for him" It is a bunch a bull.

3) yes I am you need to go back and look QB have about the same passing % then and now. Wait how many games did Tebow start his rookie season??? That's right 3 with a coach who would let him throw and had a 50% passing rate. With John Fox his % dropped in I will say first full season only cause he played in 11 games (not to include the playoffs)

4) Thinking he is overrated compared to cannot play when Ben has way more weapons is a big difference.

5) the team was not overrated the defense was. Get rid of those who believe Tebow wins games by himself no one gives credit to the offensive instead all you hear is the defensive is so great. The Broncos team is a sorry team that is what made them so fun to talk and watch because they found a way to beat teams. Half the teams with above average defense and record when they played with less talented players.

Wow no respect for his passing because they know Fox is not going to call for a pass, it is why the Steelers got burned on the pass to Thomas. Only once that game did they throw on first down. I would not respect your passing game. The Bears, Jets, Dolphins thought the same thing till they let Tebow pass (from the pocket) and got beat. He also threw from the pocket in his three starts his rookie season. To say he cannot throw from the pocket was the same garbage I heard about Steve Young in Tampa. Did pretty good in San Fran when he had players and the right schemes to throw in.

No I have see them and I am not saying they cannot throw deep, what I said they throw a ton more short passes which sets up the long. You really to look how many times on the long passes the receivers save Brady, Brees and Rodgers. A lot of under thrown or off target where the receivers go and get with the nice extendsion. Look at the TDs Brady thrown against the Broncos. Even the one to Branch. Branch had to slow down and caught in on the back shoulder, closer to the defender. If that was the Broncos especially Decker he would not have slow down and all we would hear Tebow under threw. TAPE DOES NOT LIE.

8) Smith a bust???? I will go with they said the same thing about Young in Tampa, had a change of coaches and now look he is in the HoF. I am not saying Smith will be a Hofer but people are quick to judge and all the problem was the leadership on the team was not putting the players in schemes to succeed.

1/18/12   |   derms33   |   17642 respect

 John Elway should quit "making the calls"

1/17/12   |   kantwistaye   |   4210 respect

scquwi1 wrote:
Ok wait first the Patriots had #17 rush defense which is what Jon Fox is know for running. So instead of going after their weakness the Broncos played into the Patriots strenghts.

Saying it is the only thing Tebow could do is again wrong, look when he was under McDaniels he threw the ball and know one was claiming he could not throw in the league. Instead people said he could, then this year Fox change it to help Tebow. No way he sent it up thinking the Broncos would lose the first two games under Tebow and when they did not little by little they change the offense. Newton ran more of option offense this year so that is a good argument.

Tebow 46.5% is lower then Blaine Gabbert, WOW really you are going with that. Elway's was 47.5% his was below Blaine Gabberts too. Proves nothing another weak stat. Ok so you have a 1 point difference (NOT EVEN A POINT)  between what the team score with Orton and Tebow so you show that the Broncos score just as much with Tebow as they did with Orton.

Bad Steelers team  true you had injuries still lets put the teams side by side and the Broncos still have the worst of the two teams. Do not make excuses for the lost. The Broncos lost their #1 receiver Eric Decker (who has been in the league for 2 years) and had to go with Thomas as a #1 and the Broncos had no TEs. There is not a real #1 on that team.

 It is laughable again you bringing up the Broncos were 25th in scoring when the Steelers were tied for 21st. They out scores the Broncos by 16 points. Wow that says a lot more when you look at the receivers and backs for the Broncos compared to the Steelers and the Broncos were only 16 points behind. The Steelers had way more weapons on offensive. 

The defensive only played great against teams with had a weak offense, the Raiders just got Palmer and the Chargers just found ways to lose. The Bears, Jets, and Raiders were above .500 when the Broncos meet them and beat. After  that game each of those teams had their future in their hands and could have made it to the playoffs. Saying they were 8-8 in not a good point the Giants were 9-7 and one game from the Super Bowl. you can go back and said look at the teams they lost too. That is why they play 16 games and those who want it and have the talent move on.

You like 99% of fans and even the experts not one time go though the game and see all the drop passes (Which the Broncos lead the league), the o-line break down and when Tebow does scramble the receivers mostly were cover. Look at the NE games 95% of the time the receivers were covered. Then they do not go and fight for the balls. Break it down and see how receivers go after under throw and up to get the pass, compare to Rodgers, Brees, Brady, Manning's receivers. Look at Rodgers when he receivers dropped passes against the Giants, he was losing it on the field and that was an every game thing for Tebow.

Love Billywa joke, throw shorter passes, wow to bad the Broncos do not call for short pass routes. instead they go for the longer ones. no wonder Tebow % is low look at Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Manning they all have short passes to get in rhythm.

All of you who think Tebow will not be around and think he is a bust I would bet thought Alex Smith was a bust too. Look what happens when you bring in a real coach who can call plays and bring a team together. If the Broncos go out get a TE or 2, the O-line will get better


Oh yeah I hear it a lot that Fox and Elway gave in to the fans to play Tebow, if this is true do you really want them to run the team and think that their decisions are whats best for this team? Come on you know you would not want that, instead you would want a coach and GM to play those they think will give them the best shot at winning. It has been said Elway wanted Tebow to start  from the beginning to see what they had and it was Fox who was against it. That would seem more logical then to think that Elway said oh wait the fans want him lets put him in Jon.

1) Pats had 17th ranked rush defense because their secondary was so bad you'd be stupid to run against them. Also, you had to pass to keep up with Tom Brady.

2) Huh?

3) You're comparing 1983 to 2011-12.  Passing percentages are considerably higher in this age. Also, you're comparing Elway's rookie year to Tebow's second. In Elway's second year he completed 56.3% of his passes. Almost 10% better in a tougher passing era.

4) Pat also thinks Ben Roethlisberger is overrated. So..

5) The weak schedule means the entire team was overrated. Regardless, the defense was clearly the strenght of the team.  The regression to the mean next year will be rough.

6) Dude, Tim Tebow had no pocket presence what so ever and was far better on the run than in the pocket.  He was better on the run because the defense never respect his passing ability and, to his credit, he sometimes made teams pay big by hitting Thomas who is a beast in the open field after the catch.  Rodgers, Brees, Brady, and Manning do have better recievers, but those recievers don't make the 20% difference in completion percentage.

7) I take it you rarely watch Brady, Rodgers, and Brees.  Their deep passes are things of beauty.

8) Alex Smith is still a bust.  Two very good drives don't make a career.  He's still a below average QB and he's in his prime now.  Give the guy credit for showing up in the biggest moment of his career, but it doesn't change his body of work.

1/17/12   |   scquwi1   |   1227 respect

Ok wait first the Patriots had #17 rush defense which is what Jon Fox is know for running. So instead of going after their weakness the Broncos played into the Patriots strenghts.

Saying it is the only thing Tebow could do is again wrong, look when he was under McDaniels he threw the ball and know one was claiming he could not throw in the league. Instead people said he could, then this year Fox change it to help Tebow. No way he sent it up thinking the Broncos would lose the first two games under Tebow and when they did not little by little they change the offense. Newton ran more of option offense this year so that is a good argument.

Tebow 46.5% is lower then Blaine Gabbert, WOW really you are going with that. Elway's was 47.5% his was below Blaine Gabberts too. Proves nothing another weak stat. Ok so you have a 1 point difference (NOT EVEN A POINT)  between what the team score with Orton and Tebow so you show that the Broncos score just as much with Tebow as they did with Orton.

Bad Steelers team  true you had injuries still lets put the teams side by side and the Broncos still have the worst of the two teams. Do not make excuses for the lost. The Broncos lost their #1 receiver Eric Decker (who has been in the league for 2 years) and had to go with Thomas as a #1 and the Broncos had no TEs. There is not a real #1 on that team.

 It is laughable again you bringing up the Broncos were 25th in scoring when the Steelers were tied for 21st. They out scores the Broncos by 16 points. Wow that says a lot more when you look at the receivers and backs for the Broncos compared to the Steelers and the Broncos were only 16 points behind. The Steelers had way more weapons on offensive. 

The defensive only played great against teams with had a weak offense, the Raiders just got Palmer and the Chargers just found ways to lose. The Bears, Jets, and Raiders were above .500 when the Broncos meet them and beat. After  that game each of those teams had their future in their hands and could have made it to the playoffs. Saying they were 8-8 in not a good point the Giants were 9-7 and one game from the Super Bowl. you can go back and said look at the teams they lost too. That is why they play 16 games and those who want it and have the talent move on.

You like 99% of fans and even the experts not one time go though the game and see all the drop passes (Which the Broncos lead the league), the o-line break down and when Tebow does scramble the receivers mostly were cover. Look at the NE games 95% of the time the receivers were covered. Then they do not go and fight for the balls. Break it down and see how receivers go after under throw and up to get the pass, compare to Rodgers, Brees, Brady, Manning's receivers. Look at Rodgers when he receivers dropped passes against the Giants, he was losing it on the field and that was an every game thing for Tebow.

Love Billywa joke, throw shorter passes, wow to bad the Broncos do not call for short pass routes. instead they go for the longer ones. no wonder Tebow % is low look at Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Manning they all have short passes to get in rhythm.

All of you who think Tebow will not be around and think he is a bust I would bet thought Alex Smith was a bust too. Look what happens when you bring in a real coach who can call plays and bring a team together. If the Broncos go out get a TE or 2, the O-line will get better


Oh yeah I hear it a lot that Fox and Elway gave in to the fans to play Tebow, if this is true do you really want them to run the team and think that their decisions are whats best for this team? Come on you know you would not want that, instead you would want a coach and GM to play those they think will give them the best shot at winning. It has been said Elway wanted Tebow to start  from the beginning to see what they had and it was Fox who was against it. That would seem more logical then to think that Elway said oh wait the fans want him lets put him in Jon.

1/17/12   |   kobe_lova   |   61187 respect

Oh, how that title tickled me...

1/17/12   |   beerstudk   |   1538 respect

Let's not get too carried away... Elway only said he's the starter going into training camp, not for the future.  I think  it's obvious to me that Elway want's nothing to do with Tebow and can't wait to get him off of his roster.  He's actually handled it pretty well considering how some people percieve Tesus.

1/17/12   |   billywa   |   658 respect

(Edited by billywa)

One thing to add Pat...the Broncos will also have to teach their pass catchers to run shorter routes so they can take advantage of Tebow's deadly accuracy in throwing five yards short of his intended receiver...