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CHEATIES

CHEATIES - NFL Photo

FanIQ's Rating: 6.3 (97 votes)
Submitted Dec 2nd, 2007
by: RockyTop

Sport: NFL

Tagged as:
  No Tags...



 &nbp;
TOP COMMENT * * * * * * * * * * * *
#122 | 2420 days ago

Pat wrote:
I'm sorry...I can't hear you...you need to speak up, whenever you're talking to me from...wherever fans of 2-loss teams are. Over here in undefeatedland, I can't hear a word you're saying.
It doesn't matter where I and the rest of the Colts fans are.....  At least people don't hate us.

P.S. - It really doesn't matter how many games you guys win in the regular season.....  The Pats are going to lose the AFC Championship game to us anyway.

Conversation over. 
  
121 Comments | Sorted by Most Recent First
Vote for your favorite comments. Fans decide the Top Comment (3+ votes) and also hide poor quality comments (4+ votes).
#1 | 2426 days ago

It's funny, but lets get over it people. I think they've proven they don't need to do it.
#2 | 2425 days ago

(Edited 12/04/07 3:07AM by isucubs)
twigs70 wrote:
It's funny, but lets get over it people. I think they've proven they don't need to do it.

maybe.. but that is a little like a retired pirate saying "hey, I don't need to plunder ships" while sitting in his fancy home with wealth and power.      true, he doesn't need to do it anymore-- but that doesn't mean he didn't need to do it to get to where he was.

 

they may not need it now.. but how much of their legacy and titles were built on or greatly aided by the cheating ?

#3 | 2425 days ago

Hahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.

 

 

12-0.

#4 | 2425 days ago

Yeah... that's pretty lame. People need to get a grip and start spending their time supporting their team instead of hating on others...
#5 | 2425 days ago

I can't help it. Still cracks me up :) lol

#6 | 2424 days ago

Natasha wrote:
Yeah... that's pretty lame. People need to get a grip and start spending their time supporting their team instead of hating on others...

maybe because if they got success based on cheating, then that hurts all of our teams since it gives them a pumped up record that creates an even worse situation when they then use that tainted success as a basis to sell players on their team.

 

that is why we have to spend our time on this because their cheating is bad for the game..  trust me, I would be much happier if they had never done it and I was teasing rocky about her team being a dynasty then.

 

oh, as for the hating..  hell,  they score a lot of points this year--  they are exciting..   if they had created it all cleanly from the beginning to the end, I would be happy for them... just like I was for the 49ers when they were an exciting offense..  and just like I am when I see the high power colts the last several years.

 

high powered offenses who excite people = great for league...        teams who create scandal and doubt on the integrity of the game = not so good.

#7 | 2423 days ago

I love the Brady saying
#8 | 2422 days ago

Its BS that they probly cheat every game and thats the only reason they are undefeated, or won previous superbowls.  BOGUS, they dont deserve any credit for any of their accomplishments

#9 | 2420 days ago

Jealousy breeds contempt. You whiners are pathetic.





Sounds like someone's jealous because their QB still sucks in big games.

#10 | 2420 days ago

Pat wrote:
Jealousy breeds contempt. You whiners are pathetic.





Sounds like someone's jealous because their QB still sucks in big games.

Umm no....  I'm not jealous.  It's just a hilarious picture!  Get off your high horse!
Poor Quality (4) This comment was voted poor quality by FanIQ (Show anyway)
#12 | 2420 days ago

Pat wrote:
I'm sorry...I can't hear you...you need to speak up, whenever you're talking to me from...wherever fans of 2-loss teams are. Over here in undefeatedland, I can't hear a word you're saying.
It doesn't matter where I and the rest of the Colts fans are.....  At least people don't hate us.

P.S. - It really doesn't matter how many games you guys win in the regular season.....  The Pats are going to lose the AFC Championship game to us anyway.

Conversation over. 
#13 | 2420 days ago

RockyTop wrote:
It doesn't matter where I and the rest of the Colts fans are.....  At least people don't hate us.

P.S. - It really doesn't matter how many games you guys win in the regular season.....  The Pats are going to lose the AFC Championship game to us anyway.

Conversation over. 
Congrats...you guys are like the Cubs...lovable losers. Let me know how that works out for you.

P.S.  How does it feel to be in complete denial? Peyton STILL sucks in the clutch, and the defense won't be there to bail him out this time. They'll be VERY lucky if they even PLAY in the AFC championship game.
#14 | 2420 days ago

Pat wrote:
Congrats...you guys are like the Cubs...lovable losers. Let me know how that works out for you.

P.S.  How does it feel to be in complete denial? Peyton STILL sucks in the clutch, and the defense won't be there to bail him out this time. They'll be VERY lucky if they even PLAY in the AFC championship game.
PMS today sweetie :(
#15 | 2420 days ago

Pat wrote:
Congrats...you guys are like the Cubs...lovable losers. Let me know how that works out for you.

P.S.  How does it feel to be in complete denial? Peyton STILL sucks in the clutch, and the defense won't be there to bail him out this time. They'll be VERY lucky if they even PLAY in the AFC championship game.
I wanted to give you a funny accolade for that comment, but I opted for the NO..... 
#16 | 2420 days ago

You guys are too cute...

I'm busy watching the Patriots b****slap the Steelers. Have fun planning your division champs party, because that's the best you'll be able to do this year. And I would invite you to ours, but it's already long over.
#17 | 2420 days ago

Hahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.

 

 

13-0.

#18 | 2403 days ago

twigs70 wrote:
It's funny, but lets get over it people. I think they've proven they don't need to do it.
 Evidently so. Or else it wouldn't have been done.
#19 | 2403 days ago

Chris wrote:

Hahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.

 

 

12-0.

Now 15-0.......but I gaurantee THE PATRIOTS WILL NOT WIN THE SUPERBOWL. They are only going to be remembered as one of the best REGULAR season teams.
#20 | 2403 days ago

 

I hope you have strong ankles............... What rule?????  OHHHHHHHHH the Roy Williams rule....

#21 | 2403 days ago

Pat wrote:
Congrats...you guys are like the Cubs...lovable losers. Let me know how that works out for you.

P.S.  How does it feel to be in complete denial? Peyton STILL sucks in the clutch, and the defense won't be there to bail him out this time. They'll be VERY lucky if they even PLAY in the AFC championship game.
Uhhhhhh, is it just me, or did the Patriots lose to the Colts in the AFC Championship game?  If that's not a big game, I don't know what is.  BTW, how long have you like the pats?  Like 10 min.?
Poor Quality (4) This comment was voted poor quality by FanIQ (Show anyway)
#23 | 2403 days ago
Buttons (+)

Peyton Manning in the 2006 AFC Championship game:

 

27-of-47 for 349 yds.  1 TD 1 INT.  Also 1 rushing TD.  Also led the Colts 70 yards down the field in just 19 seconds to set up Joseph Addai's game winning TD run.  Brady would drive the Pats to the Colts 45 YD line only to be intercepted.

 

I know your rebuttal so you don't have to say it.  Brady is 12-2 in the playoffs and has outperformed Peyton in the big spot.  Peyton always hiccups in the clutch.  There are other factors at play that make your cut and dry statistical comparisons null.  For that matter Brady has thrown for 300 yards in a playoff game 3 times, while Manning has done it 4 times, and thrown for over 400 yds once (Brady 0).  See how pointless that is.  The clutch argument went out the window last year.  

 

Fun little side note, and a bit off topic, but if Brady breaks the TD record this season he will need 1 more game then Peyton to do it.  Peyton threw all 49 of his TD's in 15 games.  In game 16 he was 1-for-2 for 6 yds.  Game 16, the game he sat out was against a Denver team he later torched in the divisional round of the playoffs for 457 yds. and 4 tds.  So who knows how many TD passes he would have had had he played that last game in 2004.  It seems 50, at least would have been a nice round number.  Must not matter to Peyton all that much.

#24 | 2403 days ago

RockyTop wrote:
It doesn't matter where I and the rest of the Colts fans are.....  At least people don't hate us.

P.S. - It really doesn't matter how many games you guys win in the regular season.....  The Pats are going to lose the AFC Championship game to us anyway.

Conversation over. 
Yea people dont hate miami fans either..............
#25 | 2403 days ago

XOSDER wrote:
Yea people dont hate miami fans either..............
No...we just feel sorry for them!
#26 | 2402 days ago
DiabloJones (+)

flhsbagger wrote:
No...we just feel sorry for them!
I appreciate your sympathy, but we have Parcells now.  I'm gonna hang my hat on that and count all my chickens and they're not even hatched, yet.
#27 | 2402 days ago

The clutch argument didn't go out the window at all. Peyton didn't have a single game in last year's playoffs that would make someone say, "wow, this is the best QB in football". He had a nice game against the Pats. Not great, but nice. And he played miserably against KC and Baltimore, and was average against the Bears.

And he usually has one good game in the playoffs. So 3 really good games over the years doesn't make him better than Brady, even though Tom has less 300- and 400-yard passing games. BUT, every single year, Peyton has one HORRIBLE game in the playoffs. Last year, he had two of them. And every year, with the exception of last year, the Colts lose that game. I'm not saying it's Peyton's fault every year, but maybe it's just a coincidence that he has a horrible game, and they lose.

Peyton's playoff choke jobs:
1999 vs Titans: 19-43, 227 yards, 0 TD, 0 INT, 60.9 rating, Colts lose 19-16
2000 @ Dolphins: 17-32, 194 yards, 1 TD, 0 INT, 82.0 rating, Colts lose 23-17
2002 @ Jets: 14-31, 137 yards, 0 TD, 2 INT, 31.2 rating, Colts lose 41-0
2003 @ Patriots: 23-47, 237 yards, 1 TD, 4 INT, 48.9 rating, Colts lose 24-14
2004 @ Patriots: 27-42, 238 yards, 0 TD, 1 INT, 69.3 rating, Colts lose 20-3
2005 vs Steelers: 22-39, 290 yards, 1 TD, 0 INT, 90.9 rating, Colts lose 21-18

Peyton's lousy games in the 2006 playoffs:
2006 vs Chiefs: 30-38, 268 yards, 1 TD, 3 INT, 71.9 rating
2006 @ Ravens: 15-30, 170 yards, 0 TD, 2 INT, 39.6 rating

This time, the defense held their opponents under 10 points in each of those games, so Peyton's choke job didn't hold down his team enough to lose. Maybe you think that Peyton's demons were exorcised in that AFC Championship game, but I wasn't terribly impressed with the 4th quarter he had against the Patriots, or with his 6-INT performance against the Chargers. I think that the Peyton Manning who chokes in the playoffs is STILL there, and waiting to come out this year.

But we'll see.
#28 | 2402 days ago
JRE1969 (+)

RockyTop wrote:
It doesn't matter where I and the rest of the Colts fans are.....  At least people don't hate us.

P.S. - It really doesn't matter how many games you guys win in the regular season.....  The Pats are going to lose the AFC Championship game to us anyway.

Conversation over. 
hmmmmmm, sounds like someone is scared!!!!!!!!!
#29 | 2402 days ago

Naturally.

"Conversation over" is a common "debating" tool, for those who are just hoping that their opponent will please be quiet, because they're running out of rebuttals, and it's only a matter of time before they're forced to admit they're wrong.
#30 | 2402 days ago

Pat wrote:
Naturally.

"Conversation over" is a common "debating" tool, for those who are just hoping that their opponent will please be quiet, because they're running out of rebuttals, and it's only a matter of time before they're forced to admit they're wrong.
Don't you mean, "Only a matter of time until the Pats lose to the Colts in the playoffs"???????

#31 | 2402 days ago

RockyTop wrote:
Don't you mean, "Only a matter of time until the Pats lose to the Colts in the playoffs"???????

We both know that's not going to happen. Stop being foolish. It's like a little kid who does something stupid/funny. It's cute once, but if they keep doing it over and over again, it loses the appeal.

The Pats are going to win the Super Bowl again this year. 19-0. Deal with it.
#32 | 2402 days ago

Pat wrote:
We both know that's not going to happen. Stop being foolish. It's like a little kid who does something stupid/funny. It's cute once, but if they keep doing it over and over again, it loses the appeal.

The Pats are going to win the Super Bowl again this year. 19-0. Deal with it.
You know.....  Every comment that you make about the Patriots reminds me why you're my favorite person on the Q........ 
#33 | 2401 days ago

RockyTop wrote:
You know.....  Every comment that you make about the Patriots reminds me why you're my favorite person on the Q........ 
Wait until they win the Super Bowl again...you'll really love me then. You're lucky I'll be out of the country, and won't have internet access quite as often.
#34 | 2401 days ago

Pat wrote:
Wait until they win the Super Bowl again...you'll really love me then. You're lucky I'll be out of the country, and won't have internet access quite as often.
Hmm...  You won't have internet access as often?  How long are we talking?  I'm looking forward to the peace and quiet!
#35 | 2401 days ago

RockyTop wrote:
Hmm...  You won't have internet access as often?  How long are we talking?  I'm looking forward to the peace and quiet!
About 6 months. But contrary to popular belief, my comments are very quiet and peaceful. The screaming noise you hear is your conscience, because it can't take it, every time you lie about thinking the Patriots will lose. You know the truth.
#36 | 2401 days ago

Pat wrote:
About 6 months. But contrary to popular belief, my comments are very quiet and peaceful. The screaming noise you hear is your conscience, because it can't take it, every time you lie about thinking the Patriots will lose. You know the truth.

no, they probably won't..    you want to deal with something ?

 

you have pissed off the rest of the league..  you have gotten caught cheating...   you have rubbed their faces in the fact that you got away without a meaningful punishment...   and if you play brady more than 1 or 2 possesions, you will be accused of trying to run up the records and putting your stars in harms way.

 

no team in recent memory deserves to be taken down a peg more than the pats based on the cheating and the arrogance following the cheating..    you did not come out and apoligize to the league and the fans and look truly remorseful...   you did not act humble..    and in doing so, you created more critics and dislike and disdain for your character and worthiness than all your titles combined. 

 

and if you get up by more than 14 in the 4th quarter of any playoff game, you just might have some defensive player come in low and late and take Brady out.   in fact, you are vunerable to the giants doing it if brady is still in the game in the 2nd quarter.   and in a lot of ways, if that happens, it will be just your team reaping what it sowed and not too many outside your team and fans will be truly upset.

 

you are also vunerable to the jags this season if you face them..    and they are a very possible 1st playoff game..   I will be rooting for one of those horrible playing condition games the pats took advantage of to beat the colts a few times.   I think the jags could very well then beat ya at your old game. :)

 

maybe you will make it through and go 19-0..   if so, congrats...     but I will be one of the people sitting there rooting for someone to stop you.

 

I think the jags are the most likely loss..  but the most fitting loss would be for you to lose to the colts in a snow-fest where the colts better running game shines.   and you will have a great afternoon for fans of 31 teams.

 

I am not jealous..   no more than the people who call for a criminal to be convicted are "jealous"..   they call for it because the person did something wrong and they want to see them punished..       the pats cheated and we don't know how long they have been doing it...   this is not an a rumor or just something that is suspected..   they did it.  I and many others do not want to see them win a title the same year they are caught cheating..

 

but go ahead and try to attack me too if it makes ya feel better...   claim I am jealous..     I would find it fairly amusing since until you cheated, the pats were largely irrelevant to me...    might i remind you that it was the COLTS who took the super bowl title from the team I root for...     the pats have been drafting behind the bears most years so you didn't affect their draft as much as other teams...    most years you do not play the bears..   the only time you played them in the "clutch" it was one of the most lopsided affairs in super bowl history...  so for the most part, they affect the bears far less than some other teams.

 

and this season, your high-powered offense is fun to watch..        if you hadn't cheated, my main thought on the team would be "fun to watch this year..  hope them and the colts meet in the championship game both healthy because it would be fun."

 

of course, if they hadn't cheated, there wouldn't have been a photo labeled "cheaties" to have this conversation on

 

 

you want to claim people who think the pats will lose are lying ?    there will be 12 teams in the playoffs..   the pats will have to win 3 games..   bad weather or a bad day or an injury, or simply a team catching fire that day and outplaying the pats..      it is all possible..  the pats will be the most likely team to win, but I am not so sure that they are more likely than the rest of the field combined by such a wide margin... 

 

so let's take the advantage of the fact that the NFL has a playoff and see what happens. :)

Poor Quality (6) This comment was voted poor quality by FanIQ (Show anyway)
#38 | 2401 days ago

Pat wrote:
The clutch argument didn't go out the window at all. Peyton didn't have a single game in last year's playoffs that would make someone say, "wow, this is the best QB in football". He had a nice game against the Pats. Not great, but nice. And he played miserably against KC and Baltimore, and was average against the Bears.

And he usually has one good game in the playoffs. So 3 really good games over the years doesn't make him better than Brady, even though Tom has less 300- and 400-yard passing games. BUT, every single year, Peyton has one HORRIBLE game in the playoffs. Last year, he had two of them. And every year, with the exception of last year, the Colts lose that game. I'm not saying it's Peyton's fault every year, but maybe it's just a coincidence that he has a horrible game, and they lose.

Peyton's playoff choke jobs:
1999 vs Titans: 19-43, 227 yards, 0 TD, 0 INT, 60.9 rating, Colts lose 19-16
2000 @ Dolphins: 17-32, 194 yards, 1 TD, 0 INT, 82.0 rating, Colts lose 23-17
2002 @ Jets: 14-31, 137 yards, 0 TD, 2 INT, 31.2 rating, Colts lose 41-0
2003 @ Patriots: 23-47, 237 yards, 1 TD, 4 INT, 48.9 rating, Colts lose 24-14
2004 @ Patriots: 27-42, 238 yards, 0 TD, 1 INT, 69.3 rating, Colts lose 20-3
2005 vs Steelers: 22-39, 290 yards, 1 TD, 0 INT, 90.9 rating, Colts lose 21-18

Peyton's lousy games in the 2006 playoffs:
2006 vs Chiefs: 30-38, 268 yards, 1 TD, 3 INT, 71.9 rating
2006 @ Ravens: 15-30, 170 yards, 0 TD, 2 INT, 39.6 rating

This time, the defense held their opponents under 10 points in each of those games, so Peyton's choke job didn't hold down his team enough to lose. Maybe you think that Peyton's demons were exorcised in that AFC Championship game, but I wasn't terribly impressed with the 4th quarter he had against the Patriots, or with his 6-INT performance against the Chargers. I think that the Peyton Manning who chokes in the playoffs is STILL there, and waiting to come out this year.

But we'll see.
Your really putting in a lot to defending your team.  That rocks, Thumbs up to u!
#39 | 2401 days ago

isucubs wrote:

no, they probably won't..    you want to deal with something ?

 

you have pissed off the rest of the league..  you have gotten caught cheating...   you have rubbed their faces in the fact that you got away without a meaningful punishment...   and if you play brady more than 1 or 2 possesions, you will be accused of trying to run up the records and putting your stars in harms way.

 

no team in recent memory deserves to be taken down a peg more than the pats based on the cheating and the arrogance following the cheating..    you did not come out and apoligize to the league and the fans and look truly remorseful...   you did not act humble..    and in doing so, you created more critics and dislike and disdain for your character and worthiness than all your titles combined. 

 

and if you get up by more than 14 in the 4th quarter of any playoff game, you just might have some defensive player come in low and late and take Brady out.   in fact, you are vunerable to the giants doing it if brady is still in the game in the 2nd quarter.   and in a lot of ways, if that happens, it will be just your team reaping what it sowed and not too many outside your team and fans will be truly upset.

 

you are also vunerable to the jags this season if you face them..    and they are a very possible 1st playoff game..   I will be rooting for one of those horrible playing condition games the pats took advantage of to beat the colts a few times.   I think the jags could very well then beat ya at your old game. :)

 

maybe you will make it through and go 19-0..   if so, congrats...     but I will be one of the people sitting there rooting for someone to stop you.

 

I think the jags are the most likely loss..  but the most fitting loss would be for you to lose to the colts in a snow-fest where the colts better running game shines.   and you will have a great afternoon for fans of 31 teams.

 

I am not jealous..   no more than the people who call for a criminal to be convicted are "jealous"..   they call for it because the person did something wrong and they want to see them punished..       the pats cheated and we don't know how long they have been doing it...   this is not an a rumor or just something that is suspected..   they did it.  I and many others do not want to see them win a title the same year they are caught cheating..

 

but go ahead and try to attack me too if it makes ya feel better...   claim I am jealous..     I would find it fairly amusing since until you cheated, the pats were largely irrelevant to me...    might i remind you that it was the COLTS who took the super bowl title from the team I root for...     the pats have been drafting behind the bears most years so you didn't affect their draft as much as other teams...    most years you do not play the bears..   the only time you played them in the "clutch" it was one of the most lopsided affairs in super bowl history...  so for the most part, they affect the bears far less than some other teams.

 

and this season, your high-powered offense is fun to watch..        if you hadn't cheated, my main thought on the team would be "fun to watch this year..  hope them and the colts meet in the championship game both healthy because it would be fun."

 

of course, if they hadn't cheated, there wouldn't have been a photo labeled "cheaties" to have this conversation on

 

 

you want to claim people who think the pats will lose are lying ?    there will be 12 teams in the playoffs..   the pats will have to win 3 games..   bad weather or a bad day or an injury, or simply a team catching fire that day and outplaying the pats..      it is all possible..  the pats will be the most likely team to win, but I am not so sure that they are more likely than the rest of the field combined by such a wide margin... 

 

so let's take the advantage of the fact that the NFL has a playoff and see what happens. :)

Wow.................Ditto!
Poor Quality (4) This comment was voted poor quality by FanIQ (Show anyway)
#41 | 2400 days ago

Pat wrote:
Jamie, Jamie, Jamie...

I'll be gentle...

1) Stop saying "you". I did not do any of this. (the Patriots didn't do all that you've accused them of either, but I'll get to that)

2) The punishment WAS meaningful. When was the last time you've seen a team get a draft pick taken away? Disregard the fact that they also have the 49ers pick. That is completely irrelevant, because it was part of a trade last year. NO NFL team has EVER lost a 1st round draft pick as part of a punishment. Even though they still have another one, it's still a meaningful punishment.

3) I'd love to hear examples of how the Patriots rubbed it in everyone's faces anyway (whatever "it" is). I think you're just hearing what the media is saying, and twisting it to mean whatever you want it to mean. Until you show me evidence that the Patriots have EVER rubbed it in people's faces, I'll just assume you're talking out of your @$$.


4) If the Patriots play Brady more than 1 or 2 possessions, and they go 16-0, and eventually 19-0, then I don't give a damn what ANYONE accuses them of. Running up the score, putting our stars in harms way, whatever. As long as he doesn't get hurt, he's just doing his job. He's a football player, and he's playing football. I'm not sure how that 2nd half of that 16th game is any more dangerous than the rest of the season, where he was completely healthy and unharmed.



5) When were the Patriots arrogant? They have always talked highly of their opponents, and until this week, they've never even wanted to talk about 16-0. There are a lot of other teams who are a LOT more arrogant than the Patriots, and for no good reason.


6) Sorry YOU didn't feel that the Pats "looked remorseful". That sounds like a personal problem...get over it.


7) Again...they've ALWAYS acted humble. ALWAYS. Even when Anthony Smith, a garbage player, guaranteed a win against the Pats, they were STILL humble and professional about it before the game. They let Smith know how foolish he was during the game, but overall, they let their playing do the talking.


8) If a defensive player comes in and takes a cheap shot on Brady, that is no one's fault but that defensive player. If they are that much of a loser, then they deserve to be banned from football. The only thing the Patriots do is play football.


9) You ARE jealous. Whether or not you want to admit it, you are. You wish your team was 15-0 right now. You wish your team had the best QB in football. You wish your team had the best WR in football. You wish your team was on the brink of their 4th SB win in this decade. If you try to deny that, then there's something wrong with you.


10) It's already been determined that the Jets were caught doing the same thing as the Patriots. Where's your outrage there? I'm waiting... And all of the football guys on ESPN say that many teams do it, or have done it. Sorry if I believe Jimmy Johnson more than I believe you, but I think he's a pretty trustworthy source on that one.

11) It sucks that you don't want them to win a championship this year. But they will. Sorry, that's just the way it is. So learn to love it.


12) I'm not attacking you. I'm just letting you (and everyone else) know how ridiculous you sound, and how much you are completely full of crap on this one.


13) If, before they were caught cheating, the Pats were not irrelevant to you, then apparently you don't watch football much. Because they're easily the most successful team of this decade...BEFORE this year. They might not directly affect the Bears, but the road to the Lombardi Trophy has gone through New England for the better part of a decade now. And that might not change soon.

 

14) It's a shame that one measly incident is enough to make you this bitter and jaded. Like you said, the offense is still fun to watch. And the team is still full of great guys. Brady, Moss, Welker, Bruschi Vrabel, Seymour, Brown, et al are an extremely likeable group of guys, if you can be objective about it.



15) Maybe people who claim they think the Pats will lose aren't lying...but it's wishful thinking. And no, "simply a team catching fire that day" will not result in a Pats loss. Teams have done that this year against them, and still lost. Every time.



But anyway...enjoy the playoffs. And learn to appreciate greatness. It's your only hope.

examples (after just a few minutes of trying) of the pats doing things that very well could be considered rubbing it in or running up the score..

 

game against washington..   

 

-up 38-0 with 11 minutes left and well within FG range (since it was the washington 7 yard line), the Pats go for it on 4th down.  they make it and score a TD to go up 45-0.

 

-up 45-0 with 7 minutes left, the pats go for it on 4th down (with a pass) and proceed to score another TD to get over 50 points.

 

 

against Buffalo...

 

-up 42-10 with 1 minute left in the 3rd quarter and on the Bills 10 yard line, they go for it on 4th down.   they then go on to score a TD to go up 49-10.

#42 | 2400 days ago

(Edited 12/29/07 2:32AM by isucubs)

as for the pats saying the right things ?

 

hey, I admit they have great media consultants that prep them and tell them the right things to say..   you said they let their play speak for them ?      read the examples above for examples of how they let their play speak as to how "humble" they are.

 

 

oh, and you asked---  "Until you show me evidence that the Patriots have EVER rubbed it in people's faces, I'll just assume you're talking out of your @$$."

 

ask Tomlinson and the Chargers about that..   or are you going to say going to the Chargers logo in the middle of the field after you won a playoff game and dancing is not "rubbing it in"..   especially when one of the dances some of them were doing was an imitation of a Chargers defensive player dance...

Poor Quality (4) This comment was voted poor quality by FanIQ (Show anyway)
#44 | 2400 days ago

isucubs wrote:

as for the pats saying the right things ?

 

hey, I admit they have great media consultants that prep them and tell them the right things to say..   you said they let their play speak for them ?      read the examples above for examples of how they let their play speak as to how "humble" they are.

 

 

oh, and you asked---  "Until you show me evidence that the Patriots have EVER rubbed it in people's faces, I'll just assume you're talking out of your @$$."

 

ask Tomlinson and the Chargers about that..   or are you going to say going to the Chargers logo in the middle of the field after you won a playoff game and dancing is not "rubbing it in"..   especially when one of the dances some of them were doing was an imitation of a Chargers defensive player dance...

Do you hear yourself right now? You're talking about football players' dances. Take a step back and think about how ridiculous you sound.

"waaaaa...Mommy, they're doing Shawn's dance...tell them to stop, Mommy, it's not fair!"

Maybe if that d-bag didn't do that retarded little dance after every mediocre play he was remotely involved in, the Patriots wouldn't have let him know how stupid he looks when he does it. When you start defending Shawn Merriman and his obnoxious "Lights Out" dance, I think that's a sign that you have run out of relevant things to say.
#45 | 2400 days ago

Pat wrote:
Do you hear yourself right now? You're talking about football players' dances. Take a step back and think about how ridiculous you sound.

"waaaaa...Mommy, they're doing Shawn's dance...tell them to stop, Mommy, it's not fair!"

Maybe if that d-bag didn't do that retarded little dance after every mediocre play he was remotely involved in, the Patriots wouldn't have let him know how stupid he looks when he does it. When you start defending Shawn Merriman and his obnoxious "Lights Out" dance, I think that's a sign that you have run out of relevant things to say.

no.. but you are the one trying to make the pats out to be this classy organization that always show respect and is above petty stuff..   and yet, after winning a hard fought game, they went to the home teams logo and mocked an opponent...      do I think merriman is a classy person ?  oh hell no...    but you asked for evidence that the pats "EVER rubbed it in people's faces".

 

they sunk the level of a guy we both seem to agree is obnoxius and they did it in front of thousands of people on the road.

#46 | 2400 days ago

isucubs wrote:

no.. but you are the one trying to make the pats out to be this classy organization that always show respect and is above petty stuff..   and yet, after winning a hard fought game, they went to the home teams logo and mocked an opponent...      do I think merriman is a classy person ?  oh hell no...    but you asked for evidence that the pats "EVER rubbed it in people's faces".

 

they sunk the level of a guy we both seem to agree is obnoxius and they did it in front of thousands of people on the road.

I'm not saying that they are the epitome of class. What I AM saying is that they are FOR THE MOST PART very classy. The leaders on the team and the stars (Brady, Seymour, Bruschi, Vrabel, Seau, Light, Moss, Welker, Maroney, etc) have never said or done anything that anyone could perceive as unprofessional or classless. Don't let the media make up your mind for you, and don't let the actions of a few guys from a year ago determine your opinion on them now.
#47 | 2400 days ago

Pat wrote:
I'm not saying that they are the epitome of class. What I AM saying is that they are FOR THE MOST PART very classy. The leaders on the team and the stars (Brady, Seymour, Bruschi, Vrabel, Seau, Light, Moss, Welker, Maroney, etc) have never said or done anything that anyone could perceive as unprofessional or classless. Don't let the media make up your mind for you, and don't let the actions of a few guys from a year ago determine your opinion on them now.
just so you know..  it was not the media that impacted me for the most part with this.. it was LT and his reaction..   I happen to think him a classy individual and his anger, actually trying to go after someone spoke much louder to me that it was something more than just routine trash-talking or celebrating than all the talk radio guys afterwards...
#48 | 2400 days ago

Pat wrote:
I'm not saying that they are the epitome of class. What I AM saying is that they are FOR THE MOST PART very classy. The leaders on the team and the stars (Brady, Seymour, Bruschi, Vrabel, Seau, Light, Moss, Welker, Maroney, etc) have never said or done anything that anyone could perceive as unprofessional or classless. Don't let the media make up your mind for you, and don't let the actions of a few guys from a year ago determine your opinion on them now.
however, that said,  very well said on the idea about not letting the media make up our minds for us..  they do have a lot of influence over time if you aren't careful, if only with saturation effect working its way subtley to slowly nudge opinion.
#49 | 2400 days ago

isucubs wrote:
just so you know..  it was not the media that impacted me for the most part with this.. it was LT and his reaction..   I happen to think him a classy individual and his anger, actually trying to go after someone spoke much louder to me that it was something more than just routine trash-talking or celebrating than all the talk radio guys afterwards...
I think that LT's classiness comes into question. Whenever someone does something remotely "disrespectful" to his team, he whines about it. But when Phillip Rivers talks smack to Jay Cutler (which should never EVER happen between QB's), I didn't hear about LT speaking up there. He's a whiner and a hypocrite.

And like I said...it was very few players who actually did the dance. It's ridiculous to taint your views towards the entire team for the actions of a couple players. And honestly, I really think the whole incident was hyped up anyway. Most likely, LT was emotional after a loss in which his coaches and teammates made some horrendous mistakes, and some players on the Patriots were just celebrating the win, and a few of them did Merriman's "dance". LT overreacted, and the media blew it up even more. If that changes your perception of the entire Patriots team and causes you to hate them, then I feel bad for you. You must lead a pretty sad life.
#50 | 2400 days ago

(Edited 12/29/07 3:38AM by isucubs)
Pat wrote:
I think that LT's classiness comes into question. Whenever someone does something remotely "disrespectful" to his team, he whines about it. But when Phillip Rivers talks smack to Jay Cutler (which should never EVER happen between QB's), I didn't hear about LT speaking up there. He's a whiner and a hypocrite.

And like I said...it was very few players who actually did the dance. It's ridiculous to taint your views towards the entire team for the actions of a couple players. And honestly, I really think the whole incident was hyped up anyway. Most likely, LT was emotional after a loss in which his coaches and teammates made some horrendous mistakes, and some players on the Patriots were just celebrating the win, and a few of them did Merriman's "dance". LT overreacted, and the media blew it up even more. If that changes your perception of the entire Patriots team and causes you to hate them, then I feel bad for you. You must lead a pretty sad life.

lol..   you have said the word hate a few times..   I don't hate them..   heck, i don't hate the cardinals in baseball or my alma mater's main rival or the packers...

 

and yes, I was disappointed in the way the qb-taunting thing was dealt with.

 

not sure I hate any professional team...   but yes, I would rather see, for instance the jags, win the super bowl...     and I do not think it is so certain and foregone a result that the pats win the super bowl as you do...     so the idea that it is so certain to happen that we all have to learn to love it and accept it already before they have actually managed to pull it off--  that might be just a tad bit premature.

 

that is why we go ahead and play the playoff games anyway. :)

#51 | 2400 days ago

isucubs wrote:

lol..   you have said the word hate a few times..   I don't hate them..   heck, i don't hate the cardinals in baseball or my alma mater's main rival or the packers...

 

and yes, I was disappointed in the way the qb-taunting thing was dealt with.

 

not sure I hate any professional team...   but yes, I would rather see, for instance the jags, win the super bowl...     and I do not think it is so certain and foregone a result that the pats win the super bowl as you do...     so the idea that it is so certain to happen that we all have to learn to love it and accept it already before they have actually managed to pull it off--  that might be just a tad bit premature.

 

that is why we go ahead and play the playoff games anyway. :)

It's no guarantee that they'll win, but everyone should get used to the idea anyway, because it's highly likely.
#52 | 2400 days ago

Pat wrote:
It's no guarantee that they'll win, but everyone should get used to the idea anyway, because it's highly likely.

lol..  on that, we only differ on a matter of degree :)       I still think they are the most likely of any of the 12 teams to win it, after all.  :)

 

headed to bed.. good night and we shall see what we shall see tommorrow and sunday as the nfl once again performs and we as fans watch and enjoy. :)

#53 | 2400 days ago

Pat wrote:
Do you hear yourself right now? You're talking about football players' dances. Take a step back and think about how ridiculous you sound.

"waaaaa...Mommy, they're doing Shawn's dance...tell them to stop, Mommy, it's not fair!"

Maybe if that d-bag didn't do that retarded little dance after every mediocre play he was remotely involved in, the Patriots wouldn't have let him know how stupid he looks when he does it. When you start defending Shawn Merriman and his obnoxious "Lights Out" dance, I think that's a sign that you have run out of relevant things to say.
Your pretty immature
#54 | 2400 days ago

MetsFan5 wrote:
Your pretty immature
And yet, I'm not the one whining about players "doing someone else's dance". So what does that tell you about LT?
#55 | 2400 days ago

isucubs wrote:

no.. but you are the one trying to make the pats out to be this classy organization that always show respect and is above petty stuff..   and yet, after winning a hard fought game, they went to the home teams logo and mocked an opponent...      do I think merriman is a classy person ?  oh hell no...    but you asked for evidence that the pats "EVER rubbed it in people's faces".

 

they sunk the level of a guy we both seem to agree is obnoxius and they did it in front of thousands of people on the road.

Ok thats onec in the last 10 years can you name another?????? They try harder than anyother team to keep there players in focus of a team sport..... Looking one game ahead....They are a very classy team...
#56 | 2396 days ago
JRE1969 (+)

I like cake. That is one factor that hasn't been brought up yet and I am disgusted by that fact.
#57 | 2366 days ago
FishMan (+)

Natasha wrote:
Yeah... that's pretty lame. People need to get a grip and start spending their time supporting their team instead of hating on others...
I might not be a Patriot fan ... one of my favorite team may be The New York Jets ... but let's face the facts here ... they would not have won that game weather New England Cheated or not ... because let's face it ... Tom Brady is an awesome QB and he has a great team behind him ... plus it's in the past ... let's move on ... it's over ... I don't care about this any more ... let's just have a good Super Bowl ...
#58 | 2364 days ago

Chris wrote:

Hahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.

 

 

13-0.

Hahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa


18-1......Nobody cares...
#59 | 2133 days ago

WOW
#60 | 2022 days ago


#61 | 2022 days ago

And Peyton WISHES he had as much success as Brady has had.

But tell me... What makes Brady any less classy? Or great, for that matter?

Tell me something that Peyton has done that Brady hasn't. Or a reason why someone would say that Brady isn't classy. I'd love to hear it.
#62 | 2022 days ago

I wasn't aware you were the expert on the relationship between Brady and Bridget Moynahan, to the extent that you are the authority on whether the breakup was classy or not. And if that's "not classy", then the fact that he dumped Reid should be considered classy in your book, as well.

Sorry, maybe I should have clarified. Aside from back-page NY Post-type gossip that none of us should really give a damn about, what makes him not classy? I'm looking for an example of this that is... you know... FOOTBALL related. Like something he has said or done in a game or press conference.

And how does it matter that Brady used to be a backup? That says nothing about him at all except that it speaks volumes to his determination and work ethic. And of course, it also says that the people who passed up on him are retarded.
#63 | 1994 days ago

hey all
#64 | 1990 days ago

(Edited 02/11/09 7:13PM by isucubs)
Pat wrote:
And Peyton WISHES he had as much success as Brady has had.

But tell me... What makes Brady any less classy? Or great, for that matter?

Tell me something that Peyton has done that Brady hasn't. Or a reason why someone would say that Brady isn't classy. I'd love to hear it.
apparently my post will not submit.. oh well.
#65 | 1961 days ago

"pats are a good team doesn't matter what anyone says about them" i would say the same thing if it were another great team and not mine :)
#66 | 1955 days ago

They suck glad they got caught
#67 | 1943 days ago

Omg i love that!!!! hahahahahah
#68 | 1939 days ago

That's funny. People write essays for comments
#69 | 1922 days ago

I don't have that much to say about them ...
#70 | 1825 days ago

18-1 and the biggest choke job ever in sports history..!!  I would like to think of it as poetic justice in the form of the New York Giants and that divine intervention catch by David Tyree. The 1972 Miami Dolphins are still the only undefeated team in NFL History with a perfect 17-0 record. The whole spygate incident shed some light on why these guys were getting away with cheating. Thank God Arlen Specter had the gutts to step up and let Bill Bellechik know that his cheating ways would not be tolerated and a formal investigation would be launched if they didn't cooperate and stop what they were doing. I don't think Brady will be the same after that injury and I predict that he will have another season ending injury around week-6 or 7. The Pats are done..!!
#71 | 1816 days ago

RockyTop wrote:
It doesn't matter where I and the rest of the Colts fans are.....  At least people don't hate us.

P.S. - It really doesn't matter how many games you guys win in the regular season.....  The Pats are going to lose the AFC Championship game to us anyway.

Conversation over. 
brady is coming back so were coming back, so we will see how much crap the colts talk this year! lol!! and who cares about how much crap people talk anyway, we dont care about that stuff .either we love it! everyone is still gonna watch us to see because we are still a good team  lol!
#72 | 1813 days ago

Brady is coming back alright but it's going to be much different than before. The Pats Offensive Line was not upgraded and the whole AFC East is much improved from last year. It is going to be a dog fight to see who wins the Division and I can guarentee you that the Pats will not be there when its all said and done..!!
#73 | 1813 days ago

Flipper72 wrote:
Brady is coming back alright but it's going to be much different than before. The Pats Offensive Line was not upgraded and the whole AFC East is much improved from last year. It is going to be a dog fight to see who wins the Division and I can guarentee you that the Pats will not be there when its all said and done..!!
That's a foolish guarantee, considering they were tied for the division lead last year, and they improved several weakness over the offseason. The Patriots are still the best team in the division.
#74 | 1812 days ago

Tell me about your Offensive Line and where the improvements are?  These guys are all one year older and the wear and tear on the body tends to take it's toll after a while. These are big line men that weight 300 plus pounds...it's going to be interesting to see how they hold up as the season progresses. I think the rock solid protection that Brady is used to having- is not going to be there this year and this will definitely affect his play when the pocket protection starts showing signs of weakness by the amount of sacks he will have this year.
There is nothing foolish about what I'm saying, it's just sheer common sense and football savvy. The O Line is old and there is no denying that fact. Once the season starts, we'll see exactly how they hold up...!!
#75 | 1812 days ago

Flipper72 wrote:
Tell me about your Offensive Line and where the improvements are?  These guys are all one year older and the wear and tear on the body tends to take it's toll after a while. These are big line men that weight 300 plus pounds...it's going to be interesting to see how they hold up as the season progresses. I think the rock solid protection that Brady is used to having- is not going to be there this year and this will definitely affect his play when the pocket protection starts showing signs of weakness by the amount of sacks he will have this year.
There is nothing foolish about what I'm saying, it's just sheer common sense and football savvy. The O Line is old and there is no denying that fact. Once the season starts, we'll see exactly how they hold up...!!
The O-line wasn't as bad as you're trying to make them sound. So since you're basing your entire argument on that flawed premise, your whole comment is moot. Galloway, Taylor, and a healthy Brady will revolutionize the offense. Burgess will bolster the D. This division belongs to New England.
#76 | 1812 days ago

Pat wrote:
The O-line wasn't as bad as you're trying to make them sound. So since you're basing your entire argument on that flawed premise, your whole comment is moot. Galloway, Taylor, and a healthy Brady will revolutionize the offense. Burgess will bolster the D. This division belongs to New England.
I like your optimism but let's see what happens when the season starts. Three players cannot compensate for five.
We'll see soon enough who will dominate the division..!!
Good job of not answering my question as to who is going to bolster the O-Line.....you remind me of slick Willy Bill Clinton!
LMAO...!! AFC EAST DOG FIGHT APPROACHING...!!!
Are You Ready For Some Football??? Oh YHea..!!!
#77 | 1812 days ago

Flipper72 wrote:
I like your optimism but let's see what happens when the season starts. Three players cannot compensate for five. We'll see soon enough who will dominate the division..!! Good job of not answering my question as to who is going to bolster the O-Line.....you remind me of slick Willy Bill Clinton! LMAO...!! AFC EAST DOG FIGHT APPROACHING...!!! Are You Ready For Some Football??? Oh YHea..!!!
Once again... the offensive line is not as bad as you are pretending. I don't need to answer anything about who is compensating for those 5 players, because those 5 players are very competent. Last year, with a new QB, chemistry and communication wasn't as good as it could have been. With Brady back, the offensive line will be more effective.
#78 | 1812 days ago

Pat wrote:
Once again... the offensive line is not as bad as you are pretending. I don't need to answer anything about who is compensating for those 5 players, because those 5 players are very competent. Last year, with a new QB, chemistry and communication wasn't as good as it could have been. With Brady back, the offensive line will be more effective.
Blocking schemes and assignments do not change and remain consistent- no matter who the QB is. Yes, communication is very important but it is up to the QB to get rid of the ball and read the defense accordingly. ...picking up blitzes can be tricky and the QB can help out the O-Line by yelling out "blitz" to the strong or weak side but again the whole point of this arguement is- the wear and tear on the Pats O-Line. They will be older, slower and more injury prone than they ever have during the Bellicheat era.
Yes, they are smart and have been consistent during their long run but I seriously think that this is the year that the rest of the league catches up to the Pats and exposes their weakness and that weakness will be their once might O-Line that is on the decline and the organization did nothing in the off-season to address that problem.
#79 | 1812 days ago

Flipper72 wrote:
Blocking schemes and assignments do not change and remain consistent- no matter who the QB is. Yes, communication is very important but it is up to the QB to get rid of the ball and read the defense accordingly. ...picking up blitzes can be tricky and the QB can help out the O-Line by yelling out "blitz" to the strong or weak side but again the whole point of this arguement is- the wear and tear on the Pats O-Line. They will be older, slower and more injury prone than they ever have during the Bellicheat era. Yes, they are smart and have been consistent during their long run but I seriously think that this is the year that the rest of the league catches up to the Pats and exposes their weakness and that weakness will be their once might O-Line that is on the decline and the organization did nothing in the off-season to address that problem.
You don't think Brady gets rid of the ball a lot quicker than Cassel?
#80 | 1811 days ago

Of course he does.....some of it is experience and some of it is the system that the HC has implemented.
However, you have to have time to find the open man when your in the pocket and that again boils down to good pass protection and a physical O-Line that can protect the QB. I remember when Nick Saban was our coach and we beat the Pats 21-0, Jason Taylor harrassed and frustrated Brady the whole game. When he didn't sack him he either threw an INT or an incomplete pass. The same line that was protecting him back then is still protecting him now. It will be interesting to see how it all plays out...!!
#81 | 1811 days ago

Flipper72 wrote:
Of course he does.....some of it is experience and some of it is the system that the HC has implemented.
However, you have to have time to find the open man when your in the pocket and that again boils down to good pass protection and a physical O-Line that can protect the QB. I remember when Nick Saban was our coach and we beat the Pats 21-0, Jason Taylor harrassed and frustrated Brady the whole game. When he didn't sack him he either threw an INT or an incomplete pass. The same line that was protecting him back then is still protecting him now. It will be interesting to see how it all plays out...!!
Wow. You're seriously bringing up a game from 4 years ago? You have officially dragged this conversation too far into the depths of stupidity. I'm done.
#82 | 1811 days ago

Nice try there Perry Mason..!!   I see right through the B.S. that you try to pull. You take one sentence in an aruguement and you go into attack mode- by making a smart ass comment to try and bail yourself out from a the obvious facts that I'm presenting you with. It doesn't matter whether it was three years ago or not, the point is Jason Taylor owned Brady that game with the same O-Line that you still currently have. It is now 3 years later and there has been no upgrade....NONE.!!   It's nothing more than simple logic that even a monkey can understand. The law of probability would suggest that there is a high risk as far as injuries are concerned for the Pats O-Line based on age, conditioning and strength of schedule..!! 

We'll shall see soon enough what happens to the Pats..!!
#83 | 1811 days ago

Flipper72 wrote:
Nice try there Perry Mason..!!   I see right through the B.S. that you try to pull. You take one sentence in an aruguement and you go into attack mode- by making a smart ass comment to try and bail yourself out from a the obvious facts that I'm presenting you with. It doesn't matter whether it was three years ago or not, the point is Jason Taylor owned Brady that game with the same O-Line that you still currently have. It is now 3 years later and there has been no upgrade....NONE.!!   It's nothing more than simple logic that even a monkey can understand. The law of probability would suggest that there is a high risk as far as injuries are concerned for the Pats O-Line based on age, conditioning and strength of schedule..!! 

We'll shall see soon enough what happens to the Pats..!!
I didn't take one sentence. I took your entire comment, which was ONLY about a game from 2005. The bottom line is that Jason Taylor, at the time, was one of the best defensive linemen in football, and Logan Mankins and Ryan O-Callahan were brand new players. So you're dead wrong. You obviously have no clue whatsoever about what you're talking about, and are nothing but a Dolphins homer, who knows nothing about any other team in the league. Enjoy your 7-9 season, tough guy.
#84 | 1790 days ago

lol!  that's too funny pat. we will let them see this season.our team will do the talking (patriots)and they will all sit back and be watching our team playing lmao!
#85 | 1788 days ago

So is the Brady injury more serious than people expected?  Is Bill Belicheat downplaying everything because he knows his season is in the hands of Tom Brady (there is no no adequate back-up behind him)??
Cassell gone....Grotkowski gone..!!    Time will tell..!!

7-9.....I guess anything is possible but I'm not seeing that at all. If we play to our capabilities and stay injury free- then we should win the AFC East. It will not be easy but I like our chances and think we are capable of doing it..!!
#86 | 1788 days ago

Flipper72 wrote:
So is the Brady injury more serious than people expected?  Is Bill Belicheat downplaying everything because he knows his season is in the hands of Tom Brady (there is no no adequate back-up behind him)??
Cassell gone....Grotkowski gone..!!    Time will tell..!!

7-9.....I guess anything is possible but I'm not seeing that at all. If we play to our capabilities and stay injury free- then we should win the AFC East. It will not be easy but I like our chances and think we are capable of doing it..!!
For starters, who the hell is Grotowski?

Second, how many teams have played to their capabilities all year, AND stayed injury free? Not many. Ever. And if the Patriots do the same, they could finish undefeated. But that's going to happen either.

Yes, the Dolphins are capable of winning the division. But realistically, you and I both know it's not going to happen.
#87 | 1788 days ago

Yhea....ok...I misspelled his name. The Pats had a QB that the Raiders picked up. He is their third string QB behind Jeff Garcia. We were injury free last year and led the league in the take away - give away department
(plus 17). I doubt that we do it again this year but I know we will be better as far as talent goes and we're going to need it considering our tough schedule...The Atlanta game wil be a good game to gauge where we are at. Indy and San Diego will show us whether or not we are ready to play with the big boys..!!

WE WILL BE READY and it will be fun to watch..!!   FINS AFC EAST CHAMPS!!!

 

 

#88 | 1788 days ago

It sounds like you're talking about Bruce Gradkowski, but he was never on the Patriots, so I'm not really sure where you're going with that. Our kicker is named Gostkowski, and we just released backup QB Kevin O'Connell... is that what you're getting at?
#89 | 1788 days ago

I got it backwards....the Pats got Andrew Walter from the Raiders. Yes, your right Gradkowski never played for the Pats (he's the Raiders 3rd string QB behind Garcia). Your kicker's name does sound familiar, so thats where the mistake lied. You also have another unproven guy by the name of Brian Hoyer.

Either way the back-up QBs behind Brady are not going to do what Cassell did last year if something tragic happens to Brady- like another season ending injury. Bill Bellicheat is a good coach (even without the spygate scandal) but it will be a monumental task for any coach to win with Andrew Walter as your starter...just ask the Raiders..!!
#90 | 1788 days ago

For starters, Brady might not get hurt. That's a distinct possibility. Second, can you honestly say that you KNOW that the Patriots backups can't do what Cassel did? Answer: no, you don't know that. I didn't see a single person who genuinely thought that Matt Cassel could lead the Patriots to 11-5 and do as well as he did. So how can you say someone else can't do the same?
#91 | 1788 days ago

Yes, Brady might not get hurt but it looked like he got banged up real good this past week. Either way, your back-up QB situation is not a good one. As far as Cassell goes, I knew a bunch of people here in Southern Cal that knew Matt Cassell would do well. First of all he went to USC. USC plays a pro type Offense and Pete Carroll is a great coach in the college ranks. Cassell did not start but he played behind some real good QBs and learned a lot. He also played behind Brady and learned a lot from him as well. USC is a QB school- it doesn't matter if your first, second or third string. You will get a shot when you hit the pro ranks. Cassell got his and made the most of it. I've seen Andrew Walters play with the Raiders and he needs a lot of work. Belicheat obviously saw something in him to go after him. If something happened to Brady, I don't think that Walter would be as successful as Cassell based on the fact that he has not been in a Patriot uniform that long.
#92 | 1788 days ago

You're spending way too much time worrying about the backup QB, especially when your team's starting QB isn't even that good, and your backups are worse. The fact is that the Patriots and Dolphins finished tied last year, and I believe the Patriots improved far more than the Dolphins did.
#93 | 1788 days ago

I'm not worrying about anything. YOU should be the one worrying. Yes, Pennington has a spaghetti arm but he did manage to work his butt off this off seson and it's paid off. He's throwing with more zip and accuracy. Once he develops a chemistry with his new WRs, then you'll see his numbers go up compared to last year- more yards, more TDs, fewer INTs and more Ws...so go ahead and keep saying how bad he sucks because once again, we will prove  you and the rest of the league wrong. If you think the Pats improved more than the Fins did in the off-season, then lets see how it pans out when the regular season kicks in. Its going to boil down to passion, determination, smarts and toughness. The Fins are very hungry right now. The Pats have lost that swagger that they once had. They will be competitive and they wil be good but to say they are with the elite teams- no longer has any validity to it.
#94 | 1788 days ago

The Patriots went 11-5 last year, WITHOUT the best player in the league. If you don't think that it's valid to say they're an elite team, you're insane. Name another team in the league that could go 11-5 with their backup QB, and then come talk to me. Until then, you're just talking out the wrong end.
#95 | 1788 days ago

11-5 and no play-offs.....18-1 and no Super Bowl....3 tarnished Super Bowl titles because of the spygate incident....you call that elite?  The Steeler teams of the 70's and the 49er teams with Montana were elite.
The best players in the league as far as QBs go are: Peyton Manning, Drew Brees and Phillip Rivers.
#96 | 1788 days ago

Flipper72 wrote:
11-5 and no play-offs.....18-1 and no Super Bowl....3 tarnished Super Bowl titles because of the spygate incident....you call that elite?  The Steeler teams of the 70's and the 49er teams with Montana were elite.
The best players in the league as far as QBs go are: Peyton Manning, Drew Brees and Phillip Rivers.
You're clearly heavily biased and delusional. I'm done.
#97 | 1788 days ago
mooser58 (+)

18-1.
#98 | 1788 days ago

11-5.
#99 | 1788 days ago

C'mon Pat, there is no need to get pissed off. Debating is good- thats how people understand each other better. Brady is a good QB and has been very efficient in Bellichik's system but he is not the best improvisational QB in the league right now. I think that Peyton Manning, Phillip Rivers and Drew Brees are better when it comes to busted plays and creating something out of nothing. Brady does have three rings but again they are tarnished because of his HC and his association with him. Brady's whole legacy will be tarnished and thats unfortunate. There is nothing bias or delusional about what I said. I think if you take a poll and let people vote on whether what I'm saying is valid or not, you will be very surprsied by the results.
#100 | 1787 days ago

Tom Brady, by any possible standard that you choose to use, is the single best overall QB in the NFL right now. It's not even possible to make an intelligent argument for any other QB, aside from possibly Peyton Manning, and even that is a stretch. The mere fact that you tried to place 3 other QB's ahead of him is a clear sign that further discussion is futile. Thank you sir, and good day.
#101 | 1787 days ago

I disagree that Brady is the single best overall QB in the NFL right now. Manning has less talent as far as his supporting cast is concerned- yet year in and year out he keeps Indy competitive no matter what player lines up. Scott Pioli was responsible for bringing in a lot of quality talent that other teams discarded and revived their careers playing for the Patriots. A lot of these players have been responsible for Brady's success.
If Manning would have had the opportunity with all those quality players every year, then he probably would have won some more Super Bowls and created a dynasty in Indy.
#102 | 1787 days ago

I can not believe what you're saying. For years, Brady was stuck with guys like David Patten, Daniel Givens, Troy Brown, Deion Branch, Reche Caldwell, etc... while Manning had Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne. Now you're just making stuff up. Your last comment is the most backwards thing I have ever seen in a Brady-Manning argument in my life.
#103 | 1787 days ago
EdSpeshel (+)

Pat wrote:
The Patriots went 11-5 last year, WITHOUT the best player in the league. If you don't think that it's valid to say they're an elite team, you're insane. Name another team in the league that could go 11-5 with their backup QB, and then come talk to me. Until then, you're just talking out the wrong end.
The Vikings went 10-6 last year with their backup running things... just saying. 

On the backup QB thing for the Pats... I wouldn't sleep on any of them.  It doesn't matter who they are.  Before Matt Cassell did what he did Tom Brady was a "backup" and led his team to the Superbowl. 

So the Patriots having a backup stomp teams into the ground isn't really a fluke thing.

As a "non Patriots" fan(Go Vikings) I'm already over it.  Brady's legacy will not be "tarnished".  He's the best as long as his knee(and shoulder)come back.

Every head coach cheats.  Coaches steal signals... players do it too.  This one got caught.  Let it go.
#104 | 1787 days ago
mooser58 (+)

Pat wrote:
11-5.
"The Pats are going to win the Super Bowl again this year. 19-0. Deal with it."
#105 | 1787 days ago

Oh, sorry... I thought we were just throwing out random won-loss records. What is the significance of this 18-1 that you speak of? I may have blocked it from my memory.
#106 | 1787 days ago

Ed, what the hell are you talking about?  Every head coach "cheats"?  REALLY..!!  Lombardi did not cheat..!!Landry did not cheat..!!  Shula did not cheat..!!  Knoll did not cheat..!!  Walsh did not cheat..!!

Yes, he got caught and  was given several warnings before he got caught to knock it off. Bellicheat ignored it and kept on with his cheating ways. He showed his arrogance and a consistent pattern of defiance by continuing with this kind of behavior. The punishment was a slap on the hand- it should have been much harsher than what it was. A good coach will never have to resort to stealing signals. You win fair and square- no excuses...if the game plan sucked and the other team was more talented, then it should be accepted and you try again next time. Any person that thinks cheating is acceptable is low life dirt bag..!!

Brady is not the best and never will be. He is a good QB because of the system he is in. If you take him out of the system, then he is a fish out water. Manning, Rivers and Brees are definitely more talented but Brady has a better supporting cast around him and always has since he's been a Patriot. The players on the Pats squad understand their role and they buy into that philosophy and it works. They play well as a team and thats how they've managed to be so successful. Thats how this arguement needs to be looked at. Brady as an individual performer.....if you put him on another team and in a different system where you ask him to do more, I can guarentee you that he would not be that successful..!!

 

#107 | 1787 days ago

Without scrolling up to see the list I posted earlier, name a few of the WR's that Brady had in his supporting cast before Moss showed up. The fact is that you are making stuff up now. The Patriots never had a great offense around Brady until 2007. That is a fact. They had a makeshift group of journeyman WR's that no one else wanted.

Tom Brady led the league in passing yards and TD's with guys you have never heard of. And then, in the one season where he actually had legitimate weapons, he put together the greatest statistical season in the history of the game at the QB position. Peyton Manning has had Harrison and Wayne for years... that's just as good as Moss and Welker, whether you want to admit it or not. And NONE of those QB's that you mentioned have had even HALF the postseason success that Brady has had.

Try again... but please use facts next time, instead of just fabricating random statements.
#108 | 1787 days ago

p.s. You don't KNOW that those coaches didn't cheat. You think they didn't, you'd like to believe they didn't, but you don't KNOW that they didn't. Just like you don't know that Belichick was the only one doing it.

Please don't try to debate me if you are going to present opinion as fact. It's poor tactics.
#109 | 1787 days ago

Pat wrote:
p.s. You don't KNOW that those coaches didn't cheat. You think they didn't, you'd like to believe they didn't, but you don't KNOW that they didn't. Just like you don't know that Belichick was the only one doing it.

Please don't try to debate me if you are going to present opinion as fact. It's poor tactics.
(Nice shirt btw)... Maybe Pete Rose wasn't the only one doing it too? In my opinion Bellychuck should have been banned from football. If only my opinions were as valuable as yours.
(I'm being sarcastic about the shirt.)
#110 | 1787 days ago

pizzlewizzle wrote:
(Nice shirt btw)... Maybe Pete Rose wasn't the only one doing it too? In my opinion Bellychuck should have been banned from football. If only my opinions were as valuable as yours.
(I'm being sarcastic about the shirt.)
That seems like a stretch, but I think we could agree that Belichick got off a bit light. That's one of the things that makes me think the NFL knows that he wasn't the only one doing it.
#111 | 1786 days ago

Pat wrote:
That seems like a stretch, but I think we could agree that Belichick got off a bit light. That's one of the things that makes me think the NFL knows that he wasn't the only one doing it.
What if he hid cameras in the opposing team locker room to record their... half time strategy! Yea thats what I was going to say!
#112 | 1762 days ago

Ahem... so... ummm... how about them Dolphins?
#113 | 1744 days ago

(Edited 10/15/09 1:06AM by isucubs)
I think it is time for some numbers..

NFL leaders

2001-  Kurt Warner for yards and TDs (36-18 in TDs).
2002- Rich Gannon for Yards, Brady for TDs with 28 (1 more than a 3 way tie including Peyton)
2003-  Peyton for Yards, Brett Favre for TDs (32-23 over Brady)
2004- Daunte Culpepper for Yards, Peyton for TDs (49-28 over Brady)
2005-  Brady for yards ,Palmer for TDs (32-26 over Brady)
2006- Brees for Yards, Peyton for TDs (31-24)
2007- Brady for Both

Both sides have a point here--   Pat is right that Brady lead the league with lesser WR before 2007.   The critics are right that he won those titles in the WEAKEST performances of the period (his passing yard title came with only 4110 yards)  with tiny margins where no other QB stepped up (we could go into debates about his passing yards title in 2005 with backup info where Warner/McNabb/Bulger all actually averaged more yards per game, 20 yards/game for McNabb and 30 yard/game for Bulger  but missed games due to injuries with Mcnabb and Bulger also averaging more TDs per game as well--   or where Trent Green finished less than 100 yards behind him while actually averaging more yards per attempt..).


But the main point is this back and forth about supporting casts..   Pat, you love to point out that his WR were weaker.. but supporting cast includes the rest of the team and Brady had a FAR better defense those years.. The fact that Manning kept taking his team to playoffs with large win totals despite having a so-so defense just shows his greatness.


we have had this out a number of times Pat--   you love Brady and think he is the greatest.. I support Manning as greater... I do not think we will resolve this unless 1 of the 2 following happens..  Brady puts together 2 or 3 more seasons like he had in 2007 while Peyton declines so that Manning's stats are not clearly superior..  or Manning wins a few more titles while Brady doesn't and wipes out Brady's title advantage.
#114 | 1744 days ago

Look at the playoff numbers... the defense has NOT been as bad as people claim. The Colts' offense has been the culprit most of the time when they've lost in the postseason, except of course that 41-0 loss to the Jets, when they sucked incredibly bad on BOTH sides of the ball. You can blame it on the defense all you want, but it's simply not reasonable to expect them to win the game when the offense sucks as bad as it has in the Colts' playoff losses.
#115 | 1744 days ago

Pat wrote:
Look at the playoff numbers... the defense has NOT been as bad as people claim. The Colts' offense has been the culprit most of the time when they've lost in the postseason, except of course that 41-0 loss to the Jets, when they sucked incredibly bad on BOTH sides of the ball. You can blame it on the defense all you want, but it's simply not reasonable to expect them to win the game when the offense sucks as bad as it has in the Colts' playoff losses.
most of those playoff losses were due to Patriots defense stopping Peyton while Brady did so-so against the Colts much lower regarded defense but was enough to win with Pats shutdown defense that day.  Once again going back to the fact that Pats had better defense most of those years.
#116 | 1744 days ago

isucubs wrote:
most of those playoff losses were due to Patriots defense stopping Peyton while Brady did so-so against the Colts much lower regarded defense but was enough to win with Pats shutdown defense that day.  Once again going back to the fact that Pats had better defense most of those years.
Then how would you explain the Titans holding them to 16 points, the Dolphins holding them to 17, the Jets shutting them out, the Steelers holding them to 18, and the Chargers holding them to 17?

I'm sorry, you can't pin those losses on the defense, when your offense can't even put up 20 points. In the 8 Colts playoff losses in the Peyton Manning era, they have scored an average of 13.6 points. You can NOT blame that on the defense. Even the best defenses in the league will lose a lot of games when you don't even give them 14 points per game.
#117 | 1744 days ago

2 prime examples..

2003-2004-  Colts score 41 and 38 to win 1st 2 playoff games..  then Pats hold them to 14 and win in AFC championship.
2004-2005- Colts score 49 points in 1st playoff game and then Pats hold them to 3 to win in next round.
#118 | 1744 days ago

isucubs wrote:
2 prime examples..

2003-2004-  Colts score 41 and 38 to win 1st 2 playoff games..  then Pats hold them to 14 and win in AFC championship.
2004-2005- Colts score 49 points in 1st playoff game and then Pats hold them to 3 to win in next round.
Exactly... that's why it's called "choking". Because every year, Peyton shows that he has the ability to do well in the playoffs, but has at least one game where he chokes it away by putting up a terrible performance. Those times, it happened against the Patriots. But it has happened against other teams as well.

It even happened the year they won the Super Bowl... TWICE. He was terrible against both the Chiefs and the Ravens. But that time, their much-maligned defense saved his ass, holding those teams to 8 and 6 points, respectively.

The only sure things in life are death, taxes and Peyton Manning playing like crap in the playoffs at least once.
#119 | 1744 days ago

Pat wrote:
Exactly... that's why it's called "choking". Because every year, Peyton shows that he has the ability to do well in the playoffs, but has at least one game where he chokes it away by putting up a terrible performance. Those times, it happened against the Patriots. But it has happened against other teams as well.

It even happened the year they won the Super Bowl... TWICE. He was terrible against both the Chiefs and the Ravens. But that time, their much-maligned defense saved his ass, holding those teams to 8 and 6 points, respectively.

The only sure things in life are death, taxes and Peyton Manning playing like crap in the playoffs at least once.
careful.. I have shown before where Brady has bad playoffs performances far more often than his "clutch" rep would suggest.. difference is that Pats defense usually picks him up.. In fact, he has only really had ONE GOOD super bowl performance (Carolina).. but his defense picks him up most of the time he struggles. 

1st title was the DEFENSE holding down the awesome rams while brady plodded along for something like 145 yards passing..   

Also.. 

2001-  Pats win 16-13 in OT over Raiders. 
Jan 10, 2004..  Pats 17-14 over Titans.   In the final 3 quarters, Brady goes 11-25 for 49 yards passing.
2006--  Broncos beat them 27-13..  Pats turn it over 5 times.
2008--  Pats win 21-12, Brady throws 3 INTs.

Oh, and then the Super Bowl against the Giants.

So Brady may get the rep for winning because his team wins but he has not exactly set the world on fire every time out.
#120 | 1094 days ago
wILLIERDAVIS (+)

 love it
#121 | 1093 days ago

almost used that 4 my photo profile

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